Something I always wanted to know - 1:1 copies

Hello PlayStation experts,
Why has it never been possible to burn PlayStation 1 and PlayStation 2 games and play them on an unmodded console?
As far as I know PS3 discs cannot be copied on the PC that easily.
(So you cannot/could not even burn them on a disc.)
However, this is possible for PS1 games and PS2 games, yet they won't start unless you have a modchip or use Swap Magic.

Are there any special sectors that can't be burn, or what exactly is the problem?
(Maybe the discs have some unique keys that aren't files!?)

I'm sure this question has been answered very often but I could not find it, though.

Thank you!

I think its to do with the watermark on the disc, so 1:1 backups won't work as the disc your burning to won't have the playstation water mark on it, thus the need for chipping consoles which stops them looking for the watermark or simply lies to the console and tells it that there is a watermark...

Thank you.
Yes, I also saw that PS symbol on the disc (there are several ones).
It's an interesting idea and I did not understand why Sony did not use that method for the PS3 discs.

Probably PS1 discs have some watermarks too.
Hehe, one time I had a black empty cd and thought it would be perfectly suitable for 1:1 copies, but I was wrong^^

official ps2 game discs are pressed, not burned. this process is not possible to replicate using a pc, so you can never make something that the ps2 hardware will accept as a ps2 disc on a unmodded console.

Ah, very very interesting.
Hmm, I wonder how they made the Swap Magic discs then.
I mean theoretically some guys could have used the same method to create PS2 games and sell them for little money.
(Like in Thailand where the copies look very authentic, but of course they won't work either.)

i think we all wondered how they made the swap magic discs lol
i think i half remember hearing that those discs were originally crazy taxi games that the makers mixed with data from their own discs. i could be wrong though, maybe someone else around knows better

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CouldBeYourName

Hello PlayStation experts,
Why has it never been possible to burn PlayStation 1 and PlayStation 2 games and play them on an unmodded console?
As far as I know PS3 discs cannot be copied on the PC that easily.
(So you cannot/could not even burn them on a disc.)
However, this is possible for PS1 games and PS2 games, yet they won't start unless you have a modchip or use Swap Magic.

Are there any special sectors that can't be burn, or what exactly is the problem?
(Maybe the discs have some unique keys that aren't files!?)

I'm sure this question has been answered very often but I could not find it, though.

Thank you!

---

As far as I know, the PS1-CD and PS2-CD (not DVD) Protection works this way,...
-the SLES/SCES/SLUS/...-ID is within the error-correction of a sector.
-this modified error-correction 'gets corrected' to values, which are valid if they would follow the standard 100%.

As far as I know, it is possible to copy PS1-CDs and PS2-CDs with a DVD-Reader/Writer which has no error-correction at all (EVERY CD-Device has that, so on DVD-Writers, it must be disabled by software, if possible).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MonkeyGlue

I think its to do with the watermark on the disc, so 1:1 backups won't work as the disc your burning to won't have the playstation water mark on it, thus the need for chipping consoles which stops them looking for the watermark or simply lies to the console and tells it that there is a watermark...

---

No obviously it doesn't have to do with it.
I have 2 original (&licenced) PS2-CDs here with no Watermark at all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CouldBeYourName

Thank you.
Yes, I also saw that PS symbol on the disc (there are several ones).
It's an interesting idea and I did not understand why Sony did not use that method for the PS3 discs.

---

Because they didn't even used that method for their PS1-, or PS2-Discs, unlike Nintendo did with the GameCube and a Barcode on those Mini-Discs.

Quote:

---

Probably PS1 discs have some watermarks too.
Hehe, one time I had a black empty cd and thought it would be perfectly suitable for 1:1 copies, but I was wrong^^

---

Nope, they don't.
As far as I know, it is a sector-based copyprotection.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NoWayOut

official ps2 game discs are pressed, not burned.

---

True and it is the cause of the 'issue', because the sectors of a burned backup are never as 'clean' as a pressed copy.

If a sector-based copyprotection is based on the error-correctment-bits or the sub-channels of a sector, it is possible to detect if it is tampered with them.

Now we have 2 times, when it is tampered with.
First, while reading:
The error-correction is 're-corrected' to the closest value to 0.
Second,while writing:
While 'burning', there EVER arise 'correctable read-errors' even in the error-correction.

Quote:

---

this process is not possible to replicate using a pc, so you can never make something that the ps2 hardware will accept as a ps2 disc on a unmodded console.

---

It seems that this isn't entirely true.
Atleast PS1/PS2-CDs might be copy-able.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CouldBeYourName

Ah, very very interesting.
Hmm, I wonder how they made the Swap Magic discs then.
I mean theoretically some guys could have used the same method to create PS2 games and sell them for little money.
(Like in Thailand where the copies look very authentic, but of course they won't work either.)

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NoWayOut

i think we all wondered how they made the swap magic discs lol
i think i half remember hearing that those discs were originally crazy taxi games that the makers mixed with data from their own discs. i could be wrong though, maybe someone else around knows better

---

Yes, for the SwapMagic CD they used Crazy-Taxi.
They got the glass-master (learn about the creation of optical discs, if you do not knowwhat that is...) of Crazy-Taxi (because it got one of the highest TOCs for PS2-CDs), and used it to have a valid boot-sector.

l.oliveira is a good source for this kind of question thought. ;)

Wow, thank you very much for that answer!
You taught us a nice lesson. :)

Yep I learned something too, thanks TNA.

The attached file is the document which I think explains it. (From sksapps.com (Zoneloader))