Anyone know why some PS2 games waste memorycard space needlessly?

[Cyber Akuma]

I was dissecting some of my PS2 saves to look at what they contained when I saw something interesting about Onimusha.

Basically, a ps2 save contains a minimum of three components:
- A file that identifies the game (and usually contains the save data)
(for US games, this would be "BASLUS-#####", where ##### is the game's number, its written on the side of the case in the format SLUS #####. For example, Onimusha has SLUS 20018 written on it so the file would be called "BASLUS-20018". Japanese games are SLPM instead of SLUS, and other region games have different 4 letters too)

- An icon.sys file which basically tells the PS2 when the save was made, what icons the save uses (notice how some games the icon changed if you copy and/or delete the data) it's copy protection flags (hidden, undeletable, cannot copy, cannot move, etc) and background coloring/lighting/etc when you select that save data (notice how each save has a different background when you select it)

- At least one icon, can be named anything, the filenames are defined in icon.sys

And of course, there can be other files as well depending on the game, the first four .hack games for example had a seperate file within the main .hack save for each of the 12 save slots you get, and there can be extra icons (such as for copying or deleting) as well. Also some games prefer to save the data in another file and just keep a blank or minimum ID file in the save.



However, I noticed that some games blatantly waste space on the memorycard. While this wont be a problem with the PS3 since even a 20GB hdd will probably fit the save data of eveyr ps3 game that will ever be made and still not evne come close to being full, for a ps2 which only has a 8meg memorycard, this can be a problem.

The biggest space-waster I noticed was, by default, if a game had only ONE icon, icon.sys lists the same file for all 3 types of icons (view, copy and delete).

MegaMan X7 for example, the icon file is called "x7icon.ico". "icon.sys" lists "x7icon.ico" as the View, Copy, and Delete icon, so its really the same icon being display all the time for that save data.

But then there are games like Onimusha...

Now, the actual file where Onimusha stores it's data is BASLUS-20018, this file is only 16k, 16k! Thats all the game needs to store all your daya, so why does a single onimusha save take 420k then?

Well, the view icon, "slime1.ico" (No, I have NO idea why they called it slime) is 126K alone. Basically, just the 3D icon of Samanosuke (the main character of Onimusha 1 for those that don't know) standing there and staring at his gauntlet, takes up almost 8 times as much space as the actual game data. Then there is the copy icon and the delete icon, the copy icon has him running after his gauntlet and the delete icon is him sitting down being depressed. Each of these is also 126k. So in total, 420k is needed to save when you only need 16k to save your data, the rest of that 402k is mostly wasted on just the fancy icons. I am not saying I don't like the icons and they should go away, but ive seen many games with very tiny icons in terms of space they take up, its kinda ridiculous when the flashy icon of a save takes up 99% of the space of the save itself, the save data barely taking up that last 1%.

Then for the real big space wasters, there are games like Alien Hominid or Bloody Roar 3, I know ive seen many others do this too but at the moment none spring to mind.

They also have three icons, in the case of Bloody Roar, it's save data "BASLUS-20212file1" takes a measly 2k! Yet a save is around 130k. The view icon is called "view.ico" the copy icon is called "copy.ico" and the delete icon is called "del.ico". EACH icon takes up 42.1K.

Now, here is the crazy part, all 3 of those icon files are the EXACT SAME FILE. There is no animation or color difference, they are the exact same icon file copied over 3 times into the save and renamed, when they could have easily just put only one of them and told icon.sys to use the same one for all 3.

I really have no idea why they are going this, I don't think its to waste memorycard space on purpose because the publishers would have nothing to gain if people bought more memorycards, but this is like extremely basic computing, if they can program a game they aught to know about this...

I would probably have over 3x the free space I do now on my 4 ps2 memorycards if it wasnt for this.

[Chrushev]

freaking Splinter Cell Double agent uses 1,200ish KB =( good thing I got a 32mb card =)

most space Ive seen so far. God of War uses like 450kb

[Den Leiw]

it depends on the compression of the save file
no compression means fastest loading/saving but heavy compression will make it longer

but like you said, the copy.view.delete animations take up a lot of place are NEVER! compressed



anyone remember the first smackdown for ps2 taking up 4 MB XD ?

[Cyber Akuma]

freaking Splinter Cell Double agent uses 1,200ish KB =( good thing I got a 32mb card =)

most space Ive seen so far. God of War uses like 450kb

Just to be clear. Im not talking about games that just use a lot of space, im talking about games that WASTE space with useless stuff like an insane amount of icons.

If a game uses 2 megs to save but actually uses that 2 megs of data thats fine, if a game needs 800K for example but only 10k of it is game data and the rest is wasted on having a flashy icon or other stuff, THATS what im talking about.

Granted, I don't have splinter cell nor do I know which one you are talking about so I cant tell if the data is beign wasted or not.

Oh, by the way, I highly recommend you get an official Sony 8MB memorycard. Yes they are small but ive heard so many horror stories about people that had their 16-32-etc cards suddenly start spewing corrupted data then eventually go unformatted.

Or at the very least get a way to backup the saves to your pc.

[Wuz]

I was disappointed to find that a fresh tourist trophy savegame was ~1400KB when all i'd done was saved some settings and completed 2 licences.

[anigamer]

Couldn't you replace the icon files with smaller ones and save space?

[Cyber Akuma]

Of course I could, although, theres the risk of a game actually being anal enough to check. But the point is, why do they do that in the first place? I mean, about 90%+ of the PS2 audience wont know how to do this or even realize it.

[t00p]

hitman contracts is the worst

it uses 2MB or 1/4 of your sony memory card!!!

[b081]

Nope. AFAIR, Colin McRae 2005 uses about 4MB.

[shimman]

it depends on the compression of the save file
no compression means fastest loading/saving but heavy compression will make it longer

but like you said, the copy.view.delete animations take up a lot of place are NEVER! compressed



anyone remember the first smackdown for ps2 taking up 4 MB XD ?

i don't know about that; ps2 cpu is bit slower side when it comes to integer operation, but i think the memory card interface with "magicgate" is far slower than compressing data; that is if the game saves entire contents to the memory card; however, it appears that most games create bigger than needed to create sort of mirror game data space that only very small portion will be changed to make the access time to the miminum

the problem is sony not to have a forward thinking (like all other sony products) when they first designed ps2 & tried to make tons of money out of accessory business; if they allowed game developers to save game data on usb mass storage class devices, none will complain

this is same for ps3 as memory stick is only removable device where the game data can be saved.

ms is no better and learning (or maybe showing its true color) by close the wireless interface in xbox360

i think pc as a gaming platform might have a better chance in near future than right now as graphic cards are getting better in lower end