Geohot's argument from another point of view

[Keelah Se'lai]

I don't think you can claim to release his CFW to "developers" and then make the piracy claims that George Hotz claims to make. Sony has a point. George Hotz had to know that releasing keys and developing his CFW for scene "developers" would lead to piracy. He can't just claim that he "didnt intend for piracy to happen".

It would be like the government of Afghanistan selling opium to drug dealers and then telling them they are only allowed to use the opium to make Morphine for hospitals and not to make Heroin.

[PSPOwner007]

I think that Hotz tried to "block" the piracy but in an ill fated attempt he still partially left the door open. He overlooked a few key elements and he wanted to flaunt about being the "first" again.

[Wraith92]

I don't think you can claim to release his CFW to "developers" and then make the piracy claims that George Hotz claims to make. Sony has a point. George Hotz had to know that releasing keys and developing his CFW for scene "developers" would lead to piracy. He can't just claim that he "didnt intend for piracy to happen".

It would be like the government of Afghanistan selling opium to drug dealers and then telling them they are only allowed to use the opium to make Morphine for hospitals and not to make Heroin.

I understand what you are saying, but the reality of it is you cannot "legally", at least in the U.S., hold someone responsible for the actions of others. If your point of view had merit, then that crazy ass who opened fire on a grocery store in Arizona would walk, and the folks who sold him the gun, hell even the ones who manufactured it would go to jail in his place. True it is not exactly the same, but the premise is the same. Look at it this way, if you wanted to you could prolly make an explosive using the things under yer sink. So we should just outlaw pine sol and Ajax?? I understand what you are saying, honestly. I don't mean to flame, but I hope we are not reduced as a nation to suing people based on what they "had to know".

[jim1985]

I think that Hotz tried to "block" the piracy but in an ill fated attempt he still partially left the door open. He overlooked a few key elements and he wanted to flaunt about being the "first" again.

Whether or not in doing what he did he provided developers with the means to get backups working, I don't believe that was his intentions.

As another way of looking at it; guns can be used to kill people but you can't take a gun manufacturer to court for this reason. That rule can be applied to this same case if you think about it



**Edit, ah, the poster above me beat me to making that point, lol

[Keelah Se'lai]

I understand what you are saying, but the reality of it is you cannot "legally", at least in the U.S., hold someone responsible for the actions of others. If your point of view had merit, then that crazy ass who opened fire on a grocery store in Arizona would walk, and the folks who sold him the gun, hell even the ones who manufactured it would go to jail in his place. True it is not exactly the same, but the premise is the same. Look at it this way, if you wanted to you could prolly make an explosive using the things under yer sink. So we should just outlaw pine sol and Ajax?? I understand what you are saying, honestly. I don't mean to flame, but I hope we are not reduced as a nation to suing people based on what they "had to know".

Well, the issue isn't whether he did anything illegal. But whether he can get sued for it. Geohot isn't being charged with anything. He's just getting sued. You can get sued for things that are technically legal under the law.

[Keelah Se'lai]

Whether or not in doing what he did he provided developers with the means to get backups working, I don't believe that was his intentions.

As another way of looking at it; guns can be used to kill people but you can't take a gun manufacturer to court for this reason. That rule can be applied to this same case if you think about it



**Edit, ah, the poster above me beat me to making that point, lol

Actually, under certain circumstances you could. If a gun manufacturer knowingly sold their products to members of known gangs, who then used the product to commit a murder, you could make a case (depending on your countries law concerning this crime) for criminal negligence causing death.

[JNABK]

I don't think you can claim to release his CFW to "developers" and then make the piracy claims that George Hotz claims to make. Sony has a point. George Hotz had to know that releasing keys and developing his CFW for scene "developers" would lead to piracy. He can't just claim that he "didnt intend for piracy to happen".

The same can be said about Sony releasing the PS3 in the first place too, as they were well aware people hack their consoles to do with them as they want. So Sony had to also know they were releasing a new console that would be targeted by the very same 'pirates' that have targeted other console before. So by George releasing 'developer only' releases, he still isnt contributing to any piracy, as it will take the pirate developers to create something, with his releases.
Its another stepping-stone towards pirates achieving the goal, but Sony cast the first stone on the ground by releasing a console that was not as secure as they believed it was. George cast another stone, but it is still not enough all by itself to allow piracy to occur, not without another stepping stone to tread on.

It would be like the government of Afghanistan selling opium to drug dealers and then telling them they are only allowed to use the opium to make Morphine for hospitals and not to make Heroin.

That doesnt make any sense, why would they sell to drug dealers , if it was intended for Hospitals?


Now if Afghanistan was selling opium to the Hospitals to make the Morphine and the drug dealers figure out how to hijack the shipments, then you might be more on the ball with that comparision.

[cookie42]

Eugh. This thread should be deleted immediatly. Enough threads have been ruined with clutter like this. I'm not saying you can't have a point fo view, i'm saying it's all been said before and we're sick of seeing it.

[Keelah Se'lai]

Eugh. This thread should be deleted immediatly. Enough threads have been ruined with clutter like this. I'm not saying you can't have a point fo view, i'm saying it's all been said before and we're sick of seeing it.

Then why did you look?

[ChipD]

I think that Hotz tried to "block" the piracy but in an ill fated attempt he still partially left the door open. He overlooked a few key elements.

He was just following in sonys footsteps.