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Help-no booting following CC 2.0 install
Help-no booting following CC 2.0 install –
If anyone can provide direction please do. My console is a PS2 V15b Here is what I have done so far:
1) Installed Crystal Chip 2.0, performed basic continuity checks.
2) reassembled system, bios disc got red screen, PS2 games booted.
3) Realized chip has self test, unassembled system,self test failed.
4) Found wire T in wrong location and correcetd this.
5) Chip self test passed, reassembled system.
Now nothing boots. Screen is black. Power/reset LED goes from red to green and stays green as it should. Disk drive runs fine. Advice fron anyone with CC experience would be greatly appreciated. I am new to the game and a little stumped at this point. Thanks.
Does your led for the bios test turn on for about one full second? That is what you want.
I was mistaken on previous install tries as I've has that led flash for a split second and 4-5 seconds. They should be more specific in the manual about how long a "brief moment" should be because a split second, a full second, and a few seconds can all be considered "brief moments".
Anyhow, you want a good solid second of that led being on. No shorter, no longer.
If you get a second on that, then your problem most definitely lies with the cd/dvd points.
However, since you powered up without wires being in the right place previously, you might want to check your fuses.
I know I blew a fuse, and I'm assuming it was because I had had a couple wires mixed up when I powered on.
Back to assuming its your dvd/cd points, don't rely on passing that pin continuity test either.
Like I said I had a few install tries where I passed these tests but still didn't have a good install.
In fact, with the dvd/cd test, I always passed that perfectly, yet still that was where my problem kept lying.
First off, on the chip, make sure those wires are flat against the chip when soldered. Do that by maybe soldering the wires to that first, or use a good pair of tweezers to keep that wire end lying flat.
More importantly, as I found out, is that you want a good strong joint on those dvd/cd points. Although I connected the wires to those points, they often were barely sticking there due to the lack of being able to use enough solder.
However, consider yourself lucky. If your v15 goes off the v15b diagram, the cd/dvd points are much easier.
I used the 15a diagram. Take a look at that and you'll see how all those points are so close together, and I even soldered the optional F point. So you are fortunate that you have room to work with on these points on the v15b board.
Every time I would get to like the 4th, 5th, or 6th wire in that bunch, the nearby heat from the iron would knock 1 or 2 wires off every time I try to put one on!
Anyhow, you shouldn't have that problem on 15b, however, those points still aren't easy to solder.
Do as the manual says for those tiny circle points. Heat them up for a few seconds with tip of the iron, then scrape gently (I use the corner edge of a flathead) until it turns more goldish.
On my bad install tries, I had problems tinning those areas, so I would just tin the wire really well and hope that it would stick to the point. The joints weren't strong, but I passed the pin test.
But that didn't matter, there was still problems there.
So here is my big tip ...
FLUX!! When browsing for help on these forums, I don't hear enough about flux. I hear that I should only use it when I absolutely need to or if solder won't stick to a point. I also hear that my rosin core solder should mostly eliminate the need for flux.
Nevermind that! Use flux! The right kind of course. Don't use that corrosive plumbers flux. I got mine at radio shack, for a few bucks. Was hardly using it.
But on my successful install, I'm sure this was the difference.
For the dvd/cd points, I used flux at every step. I used a toothpick to apply a tiny layer on those points. I held my iron tip on that point, then fed solder to the iron.
When the solder starts to melt, you should hear/see a quick sizzle, but you have a perfect tiny bead of solder on your points!
Then when it came time to solder the wires to those now tinned points, I would put another little layer of flux on top of the tinned solder points, and scrape a little flux onto my wire end as well.
Then I lay the wire on top of the bead of solder, then touch my iron to that bead.
Then in a split second, you get a sizzle, and next thing you know you have a strong joint there and you can hardly see any solder! Which is good because, at least in my case, I wanted to use as little solder as possible to avoid the problem I mentioned above with the other wires falling off.
Anyhow, using that method, I was able to get strong joints on all points (including the dreaded F point in the center of that batch). This time, I passed the pin test as always, but the difference was that this time I actually had a good install.
Also during my successful install, I used flux in other spots that I wasn't doing before.
On the bios pads, I wasn't using flux to tin them (just applying heat from the iron and feeding solder was good enough to get a nice bead on them). However, I was using flux the same as I did when I connected the tinned wire to the tinned cd/dvd points. Just a little flux on the tinned bios pad, and scrape a little onto the tinned wire end.
Set the wire end on the point and just touch any part of the solder bead on the bios pad. Sizzle, then again you got a nice strong joint and I didn't even come close to have any bridged bios pads as, like I said, using the flux eats up some solder, while leaving a strong joint.
Worked absolutely beautifully! Nothing better than a strong joint without even a fear of bridging.
This is especially important on the bios pads. On previous installs, I was getting solder on nearby bios pads, then using the desolder wick over and over to the point where my bios pads were about shot. Eventually they were shot, looking a bit corroded and crappy from getting solder on them, taking it off, and applying all that heat isn't good.
Definitely true that you don't want to overhead components.
In your case, your A point is a different kind of point. On my v12, my A point was different too.
Looks like your A point is just like the SX point. The A point is very vital to a good install. Make sure you solder that wire to the side of that component well enough.
Also, if I'm not mistaken, it is very important for the A point to have a very short wire (possibly the HA point as well).
I don't know where you chip is sitting. But for the v15, I wouldn't do what the manual does.
There are some good install pics people take, on another site, you might want to check those out to see how people install their chips. Seems like nobody places the chip where the manual says to.
Myself included. I installed my chip, like the pics I've seen, right near (in fact, right over top of) the cd/dvd points. I actually solder the wires to those points first, but not to the chip.
Then I set the chip near those points, the chip just covers the points, then I run the wires underneath and out the other side of the chip.
This way, all my cd/dvd wires (including the A wire) are only a couple inches long. My HA wire is only an inch since it comes out and around the same side it needs soldered to.
Not sure exactly how important it is that these wires be short, but it sure can't hurt. It also makes for a neater looking install and you don't have wires running all across the board.
What else? I also put electrical tape over my chip when I was done. I know there is a plastic layer between the board and the metal, but on my slim the plastic is loose and there are holes over where the chip is. There is a slight chance that if that plastic moves a bit when putting the slime back together that it could come in contact with parts of the chip because after the glue the chip is tight against it.
When the install is good, you will know it. First thing you will see is "crystal chips" on your tv screen w/ a blue background. That is your new boot screen.
Tools I used...
Radio Shack adjustable 15-30 watt soldering iron (had the sharpest tip) and the 15 or 30 watt settings I found quite useful. And it fits great in the Radio Shack iron holder w/sponge. Other irons were getting messed up tips cuz they were shorter (hard to explain).
Some people grind their tips. I was doing that, but now I don't. Cuz probably whatever tip you have is already coated and grinding will ruin that coating.
The life of your tip can be really short if you grind it, it is more likely to bend/chip as well.
Yeah, a sharp tip is nice, get the sharpest tip you can within you desired watt range, but don't get hung up on that.
Also, grinding a coated tip might also cause problems tinning.
NOTE: This stuff about not grinding is solely my opinion from my experience.
I also use Radio Shack tinner (hey, its the only store I have in town!). Absolutely the best, I had an impossible time tinning with my super thin rosin core solder. The tinner makes this task so quick and gives a really smooth tin. For 6 bucks, its worth it. Unless perhaps you have some thicker in diameter rosin core solder that might actually coat the tip rather than just bead up.
Used normal desolder wick. But you want to avoid using this. If you are using this too often, then that isn't good! But when you need to remove solder, its a quick, cheap way to go. I can't speak on other solder removal tools.
Multimeter. I got the beeping kind. Had another beeping kind, but it wasn't really built for smaller electronics. Watch out for that. It had a higher threshold for what it considered a good connection. So I got a multimeter more geared for small electronics, had a lower threshold for when it beeped.
Reading glasses. I have great eyesight and don't wear glasses normally. But I still got the strongest reading glasses you can buy. When looking far they can make you a bit dizzy, but close up they nearly double the size of things.
Radio Shack 5x,10x, and 15x adjustable magifying glass. Great to have for obvious reasons.
Thats about it! Those are some of the optional things that I found to be a necessity.
I hope some of this helped. I actually wrote this post for my own sake as well, I'm copying it and pasting it to a txt file for myself while its still fresh in my mind. Might want to pull it out for when I do my next install.
Also, I was looking for a post like this when I was stuck. I would of had no problem reading super long posts that go into detail. Cuz when you are doing your first chip like this, it really helps to have a guide from somebody who not only had done a successful install, but has also gone through lots of trial and error and troublshooting to get to that good install.
Good luck, and if you need more specific help, I'll be glad to help. And I will write much less!
This is very good information that will be useful to a lot of folks.
The one thing that I thought I aught to mention is that using too much flux can cause corrosion over time if the equipment is in a damp (humid) environment. I fought this type a problem a lot when I used to repair Rammax remote controls years ago. This probably will not be a problem with game consoles but just for extra info I thought I would mention it.
If you get a lot of flux in an area that makes it hard to see what you are doing ChemTronics makes a flux remover pen (they also make a flux application pen) that looks like a skinny highlighter and it literally wipes the flux residue off. That way if you have some stubborn connections that require generous flux application you can clean up the area quite easily.
The First Amendment only survives because the Second Amendment is watching over it.
Yeah, that is true, which also reminds me of something else. What little residue I do get from time to time, I just put some rubbing alcohol on a q-tip and rub the area. Cleans it up pretty well, at least for small amounts of residue.
I definitely used the words "tiny amount" when using the flux, and I do mean tiny and should stress that again.
Just a tiny coating applied with a toothpick is all I was using.
And you don't want any globs hanging off the toothpick either, just coat that as well (dip the toothpick in the flux, spin it around as you pull it out to remove excess, then even that much should be enough for you to coat a few small surfaces, you don't need to keep re-dipping the toothpick after every time).
You don't even need to be able to see it. That was enough to get those solid joints, but left no residue.
Use too much and you will have icky residue, not to mention a puff of stinky smoke in your face!
Thanks for the wealth of info
Thanks for the wealth of info –
This is a wealth of great information. Thanks for the replies. My PCB configuration is GH-051-51. At this point I have disassembled the console again and began re-verifying point to point with my fluke. I have verified all of the DSP wires back to their respective DSP pins (past the solder joint) with 0 ohms. Except HA, I am not sure what pin it should be continuous with. For some reason the mod-chip install instructions left this one out. I find that the solder joint specified connects the HA point on the chip to pin 108 on the DSP. Would any of you know if this is correct?
As for the LED it does blink for approx. 1 sec so it seems to be passing this portion. That leads me to assume HA is correct but I am not positive.
As for the DVD points I am not sure which are related specifically to the DVD drive. Again the mod-chip install does not define which points are related to which sub-system. Could you enlighten me in this area?
One thing I noticed that seems odd on the mod chip itself is that I am ringing out 0 ohms between the 3v3 pad and GND pad. Should there be continuity between these points? It doesn't seem right to me.
Anyway I have attached the install diagram that I used and the points match my board & installation exactly. As I continue to troubleshoot any more suggestions are more than welcome. Thanks for the input.
Yeah, I don't know if there is a test for the HA wire, I don't think there is or they probably would of put it in the manual.
For me, I kept the HA wire very short (shortest of all my wires except for the ground). No sure if this helped me.
But basically all I did for this wire is make sure that joint was at least as strong as the other dvd/cd points.
I think I mentioned this above (might be hard to just pick this out) that the A, B, H, I, F, G, and HA wires deal with the disc drive related stuff. F is optional, so it wouldn't hurt if that wasn't on right or at all, unless of course it is bridging to a nearby point.
The TO point, I believe, deals with the "eject" function. SX is for psx backups (optional), 3v3 is power and ground is ground (obvious). So there you have it. The points mentioned in the above paragraph are disc/drive related, then aside from the points I just mentioned in the last sentence, everything else is bios related.
But anyhow, just because you pass the bios led test doesn't mean your HA wire is good. The HA wire has nothing to do with the bios test. When you did your initial led test, if you were following the manual, the HA shouldn't even of been soldered yet.
Like I said above, I've passed both tests before and still had a failed install, so the tests aren't perfect. You could still have some bridged points that you can't see with the naked eye. Cold joints as well. Could be attached well enough to pass the bios or pin tests, but maybe not good enough to be functional.
Given I had problems even with passing tests, I'm pretty sure that just some sub-par joints or crud on nearby points (causing bridging or not) was causing my problems.
There really was no other explanation, still isn't one because on my next intall, I again passed both tests, all the wires were surely soldered to the exact same points as before, but this time I had a good install. And as I mentioned before, the only difference was that I had much better stronger joints from using tiny amounts of flux.
I had put my chip through a lot. One little component on it had a nice bit of solder on it (but I didn't want to apply the heat to desolder worried that I might really destroy the chip). had some flux residue on it. I had held a 30 watt and 15 watt iron on some of those pads for more than a few seconds at a time, or even worse.
I almost didn't try my last and successful install because I was sure I hurt the chip.
But I gave it another go just because I had just enough wire to do it.
Of course, while I put my chip through hell, it was still in good shape. I would definitely look for problems on the ps2 board before assuming the chip is at fault. It's solder points (especially ones like the SX point and similar) are much much more fragile.
So here come the part you don't want to hear. The best troubleshooting you can do at this point (if you don't see any problems with the naked eye or magnifying glass, and if you verified that all the fuses are OK), is to take the chip off.
You want to make sure the console itself is still working and that you haven't damaged any components.
And taking the chip off is the only way to do it.
I was able to get away with just removing the wires from the chip itself, leaving the rest in tact since soldering to the chip is much easier. But if you do that you must make sure none of the exposed wire ends are touching anything or each other.
If you still have problems, then get those wires off the board as well and remove all solder w/ desoldering braid or that vacuum thing (whatever works for you).
After that, you will know if you console is OK.
If its OK, gear up for another install!
As much as I hated doing that, there was a silver lining in that I got MUCH better each time I did it.
Its amazing how much better your soldering skills get when you are working on something of value$$!
I really recommend using the flux in the manner I suggested in the last post. Also make sure you tin well, you want that shiny round look.
However, I do admit that after I joined some wires to the tinned points, some of them weren't perfect looking, but were effective, especially with the flux used.
I really wish you luck, I'm just a noob to, but I know you can do it. I definitely recommend some of the tricks and tools I used in my above post.
I can't think of anything else to tell you.
Maybe somebody with more experience can add a thing or two, but when you are passing the tests and still having problems, I don't think there is a whole lot more in the line of tips that can be said.
Perhaps what could help is if another more experienced member that has worked on your exact board can maybe help out more than I can.
I'm guessing you are working on a PAL v15, which would explain why the board is quite a bit different in some areas.
Lastly, maybe if you have a good camera post a pic of your install?
Where can I find a diagram showing the fuses on the V15b GH-051-51 PCB?
Here is a CC install tut I worked up not long ago for the CC in a V15.
I dont have a fuse diagram but they will be labeled PS1-PS16 on the motherboard. Here is a close example from a V12 courtesy of kl1k
I would also recommend that before you do anything try booting the CC into recovery mode by tapping the reset button 3 times from standby with a 1 second delay between taps.
Excellent stuff Spedmetal. Love the alternate points for Q, T, U and V. I used some other alternate points for these myself which rung out as equivalent from the ohmmeter. If I have to redo my install I will use these instead. Much appreciated.