New slim Pstwo has problems.. lets solve it

[N£TM£ÇH]

This has been a very hot topic recently, over 35,000 people have shown interest here at ps2-scene. This thread is a continuation ( 3rd thread ).

[villasg]

http://www.infinitymod.com/cgi-bin/matrix/site.pl?page=news

We have finally been able to reproduce the V12 syndrome on several occasions and we believe we have
found a possible solution to the problem.
The fix will probably involve a 12c508 microcontroller (we strongly suggest using it with the proposed
diodes fix) and we plan to release the code free for all to enjoy.
Tests are still being conducted but the situation looks good so far. Everything should be available very soon

[drewid]

i would love to know how they repoduced it, so in the meantime we can avoid it :D

[Chip&Chop]

Where did all the other threads go?
I can't see them anymore.

As a matter of facts I can't see anymore anyone of the the old sticky threads that were present in the top of the forum..... :chinscrat

[cravavr3]

I beleive they had reproduced it via the power supply units,as they stated some are producing 8.5V to 9.3V's.

My bet is they found a 9.3V and plugged it and guess what, blew by there diode fix.

Why, a simple diode will drop voltage by 0.7V, now they are running 2 in series so means 0.7 + 0.7 = 1.4V droppage. The interesting part is who unpercide the power supplies are( maybe $ony will recall ). I don't know exact voltages at that point they are conencted to but if 8.5 - 1.4 = 7.1V this must be maximum allowed, and if 9.3 - 1.4 = 7.9 this is deadly to PS DEATH SYNDROME!

So in theory, if we test voltages prior to modchip install and diode-fix install, if 8.5 we use 2 diodes per line, if 9.3 we use 3 ( 0.7 * 3 = 2.1 = 9.3-2.1 =7.2V ) .

Why they using microcomtroller, maybe to control spike and wait/delay some time for voltage to drop prior to allow poer to pass through.

Intereting enough is tghey said to use in conjunction with diode-fix so assuming we will be wiring it up near the diode-fix.


P.S. The stickies wher getting way off topic i beleive, maybe should be broken into a few more sub threads ( PSTwo MOdchip Issies, PStwo dead/ fix solutions, PSTwo trouble shooting, PStwo rants/brags ( un/successful installs)

[murcielago]

and why not use a zener diode at the input like i said before?

[Gradius]

Where did all the other threads go?
I can't see them anymore.

As a matter of facts I can't see anymore anyone of the the old sticky threads that were present in the top of the forum..... :chinscrat

It was deleted. I was unable to found it too. :rolleyes:

Gradius

[Gradius]

For power supply it must be 8.5V @ 5.65A. Until 8.9V is okay since isn't exceed 5% (8.925 = 5%). +/- 5% is the max.

Just putting a little resistor on output will resolve the power supply matter.

Gradius

[Gradius]

So the safe rate is between 8.075V and 8.925V (better if 8.1V and 8.8V).

Gradius

[Nuwanda]

so basically the external powersupply/box is to blame?

[biggy7]

anyone got a link to a step by step guide for installation of the diode fix? also where in Uk can one find these diodes? anyone got any links to them?

thanks!

[charlie12]

anyone got a link to a step by step guide for installation of the diode fix?

All the info was on the previous threads, which now appear to have been deleted for some reason :-\

The diagram is on the infinity website - http://www.infinitymod.com/cgi-bin/matrix/site.pl?page=laserv12

also where in Uk can one find these diodes? anyone got any links to them?

www.farnell.co.uk
www.rapidelectronics.co.uk
www.rswww.co.uk

[murcielago]

For power supply it must be 8.5V @ 5.65A. Until 8.9V is okay since isn't exceed 5% (8.925 = 5%). +/- 5% is the max.

Just putting a little resistor on output will resolve the power supply matter.

Gradius


wich value OHMS and what Watts we need to put ?

[Chip&Chop]

It was deleted. I was unable to found it too. :rolleyes:

Gradius

I will be really sad if they deleted it.
There was a bunch of usefull informations and a lot of test done by many peoples inside those threads.... Why in the world should they have deleted them?? :( :(

[Gradius]

so basically the external powersupply/box is to blame?

Yes, but isn't the only one. You must do the "matrix-fix" (diodes) too.

Gradius

[Gradius]

I will be really sad if they deleted it.
There was a bunch of usefull informations and a lot of test done by many peoples inside those threads.... Why in the world should they have deleted them?? :( :(

Good question, I want to know too... perhaps lacks of space? Too much bandwidth consumation? I wonder.

Gradius

[TeknoZ]

I agree that it would be nice to have the old thread back. Even if it was several pages long there were a lot of useful information and discussions and it would be a shame to have that disappear?

/me want to know too why the old threads have been removed :confused:

[Unununium]

The threads were still getting to be off topic and inconclusive. I'm just going to play games on my v4 until a definite fix is found and a tutorial/guide to installing the fix is posted.

[Gradius]

wich value OHMS and what Watts we need to put ?

Just put a 5kOhms +/- 5% resistor on +V (must be on +V) output should do the job.

The colors are: Green, Black, Red and Gold.

Gradius

[Freakx]

Also the R_i_p_p_e_r_3 site has news about it.
See http://www.ripper3.com/v12_DEAD_BEEF_067.pdf

[Chip&Chop]

Also the R_i_p_p_e_r_3 site has news about it.
See http://www.ripper3.com/v12_DEAD_BEEF_067.pdf

I wonder from whom they ripped those info.... :lol: :lol: :lol:

[modordie]

Lol

[gordy_au]

I have to give them credit. What they are saying makes a lot more sense then the matrix team.

I thought the ripper team were evil (well so i was lead to believe), looks like i was wrong.

[cravavr3]

hmmm......it sound like they just reversed engineered the matrix team work. Matrix Team put everything in layman's terms rather then engineering terms. They just put engineering terms in replacement andc released details that way, no new data from them.

BTW, I would just add a 10k 25V POT in line from tke power supply and drop down to the safe 8.1 as pointed out by Gradius. POT allows fine tuning :p Or has anyone taken aprt the power supplies ( 8.5V and 9.2 V ) and seen a difference in parts. We all know big corporations use multiple manufacturers, maybe one manufacturer swapped out part due to supply and demand or used faulty device.

A simple circuit can be made, a DC male connector, one side POT to centre connector, middle connector POT to center on DC female connector, and outside both DC connectors to each other. Place POT at 1/2 way and plug cord into outlet and adjust till voltage at 8.1V then tape up so no loose wires or shorts and you should be good to go and hook up to PStwo. You coudl even do on a circuit board and all LED's if wanted.

[wmb88]

If such a voltage can be regulated by just a pot , why we need electronic engineers?

[cravavr3]

Electronic engineers need to find the percise values needed for compatibility and functionality of citcuits in question. You coudl use a simple resistor instead of a POT, but with variences in its toleramces 5%,10%,20% and variences in the output power supply 8.5 and 9.2V, using a POT can control and give more percise measurement.

Why you think older TV's used POT's, as its percise and easy way to get things done, newer TV's still USE POT's but casing needs to be removed to get at and adjust. But once a POT is set it is 100% its value no tolerances( aka billybob's 5k reads4.95k and sue's reads 5.05 , and crankyjoe's doesn't know what value his should be ) to deal with.

[davbere]

Heres a post from van drunen from another site Hey,

yes that last link was in italian and they were describing a "romeo2 mod":
http://www.hardstore.com/default.asp?cmd=getNews&cmdID=2225

Hooking up the "silent PWMx2 5-channel motor and tilt driver" to a 5 volt power supply from the PSTwo didn't work, the driver IC would just not function at all (I tried that too).

But in this site they describe using a 7805 voltage regulator that uses the ground plain of the PSTwo as a cooling ribbon. And placing two diodes in series in between the ground input of the 7805 and the ground of the PSTwo. This way they would elevate the 7805's output voltage with 1.2 volts above ground. The 7805's input is soldered to the same powersuplpy point as the tilt-driver IC, but then on the "other side" of fuse PS11 (on the bottom). Then the output of the 7805, which will be at 5 + 2*0.60 = 6.2 volts is soldered to the VCC2 of the tilt-driver.

So what they did is hooking the tracking/focussing power supply of the driver IC to 6.2 volts... one VERY BAD thing about this fix is that they soldered the input and the output to the same voltage node with fuse PS11 in between.
The driver IC is connected to both 8.5 volts via fuse PS11 and 6.2 volts via the 7805. In result fuse PS11 would burn out to seperate the two circuits and all is fine.... but what if you want to restore the PSTwo to default??? then you would have to replace the fuse.

I would say... nice fix to get the maximum current down with just a few parts. And a much more elegant solution than clipping the driver IC's input voltages to +/- 1.2 volts... that would seriously degenerate the PSTwo's speed and capability to re-focus and re-track it's discs.

Unsolder fuse PS11 when you do this (dangerous too btw)... or even better... solder the 7805's input pin to the bottom of the PSTwo on the right (protected) side of fuse PS11 and lift the pin of the driver IC off the motherboard and solder the output of the 7805 to this pin.

Here's a link to the 7805 datasheet just for reference:
http://www.national.com/ds/LM/LM7512C.pdf

ok... so this was another one of my semi-scientific analysis.. hehe... I hope it's of any use. If I wouldn't have any better ideas to fix the "PSTwo Syndrome" I would take out my camera, do this fix, make some better tutorials of this and post it on this forum. But no, you can try this if you like and in a week or two I'll introduce my own fix when it's tested and proven ... ow.. it won't be a "quick and easy" fix... but it will be a very good one. There are some serious design flaws in the PSTwo... and the only way to fix it... is to fix all flaws sufficiently.

Greetz, Edwin van Drunen

[davbere]

And another post by van drunen Hey guys (and girls)...

KaISeR SoZEi handed over some other document he got from some other (of course inferior :-p) modchip maker... and it probably desctribes very well the same cause for the PSTwo laser burning that I independently found:

http://www.ripper3.com/v12_DEAD_BEEF_067.pdf

Read the document and you'll find this out:
* DVD DSP locks up during boot or during play, most probably due to glitches and noise in the power lines.
* During lock up the DSP will no longer send adjustments to the focussing and tracking actuator, but send a DC signal instead.
* This DC signal will be amplified by the Actuator (the RS2004FS) and this huge current will burn your coil.
* Your RS2004FS will probably survive this huge power drain, because it shuts down at high temperatures, where the BA and LA chips would just burn out and die.

Up to now I have built a few "better safe than sorry" fixes for the PSTwo. I built a 3.3 volt power supply for the *** chip to help keep the 3.3 volt rail clean. A 6.6 volt power supply for the coil actuator VSS of the RS2004FS chip (like the romeo2 mod). Two current limiters built from standard opamps that are inserted in between the RS2004FS and the coils with a red warning led that will turn on when the current through the opamps is on it's maximum allowed. Also when the red light turns on, the 6.6 volt power supply to the RS2004FS chip is disabled.

When I would operate my PSTwo with all these patches applied I would hardly ever get the red warning led to turn on, except when I would continuously reset the console. Then the red light would turn on and any disc in the drive would just not boot (disc read errors) because my circuit just disabled the supply to the coils.

The only thing I could do to get it to function again was completely turning off the console (unplug power) and turn it on again... resetting would not work. I had no idea why, could not find any cause, but for sure my circuit saved my coils more than once. Now this document I think described exactely what I found but did not understand.

Those people said they would build and test a circuit that would detect this lockup and apply a reset to the DVD controller... in the same time I will try to find this reset function of the DVD controller (where the h#ck is it!) and hook up my red-light-warning circuit to this reset function. Or at first.. I will try to check if a reset of the DVD DSP will enable me to play again without having to turn off and on the system again. If it works, I can make a simple circuit that will protect your coils and reset the DSP during operation when it would ever lock up.

Ok.. it's easier said than done... I';; go to sleep now (it's 5:15 am here) and I'll post back to you guys when I find out more.

[summ0ne]

Here is another FIX:
This one i will be enforcing in my psTwos starting tomorrow, until problems appear - if they do, that is.

WHY ANOTHER FIX?
-because i am fed up with the effort it takes to mod a single pstwo, as if the 20wires of the modchip arent enough, i have to do 12-16 solder points for the diode fix.
and with talk of microcontrollers being added in order to reset the pstwo when theres something wrong - that is it! that is where i draw the line!

The fix basically truly limits the max voltage on the differential inputs of the first stage tracking&focus op-amps in the s!pwm with as little as possible elements: 2RESISTORS ;)


POSSIBLE DANGEROUS CHANGES TO THE SYSTEM:
-It does change the operating voltage range of the I/O cpu focus&tracking outputs to values closer to saturation - that is no problem and not dangerous.
-Another change is that it reduces the impedance on the focus&tracking outputs on the I/O to min 2511ohm. With the max current there thus increased to 2mA (at 5V), this i do not think is a dangerous value neither.


THE FIX:
Add a 3.9kohm to 4.3kohm resistor in parallel to focus 2u2 cap.
Add a 510ohm to 560ohm resistor in parallel to tracking 2u2 cap.


HOW DOES IT WORK?
The I/O controls the op-amp inputs. Since these are very small currents and huge impedances, there is no need to limit the signals using diodes, but we can use the outputs on the I/O hitting saturation to our advantage utilising simple 1 resistor per channel limiting.
simple: the I/O output has a max saturation voltage it can not exceed, so if we hook up a resistor - making a voltage divider between the I/O output and the s!pwm input, we determine the max voltage on the s!pwm input.
The system will still operate totally linearly when not in saturation due to the system feedback property.


HOW WERE THE PROPOSED RESISTOR VALUES DETERMINED?
I simply hooked up a series of pots between the points and kept reducing the resistance until some media started having problems being read, then increased it a bit so it still reads all media. A wide variety of media tested at various reading speeds, from DVDmovies to CDPS2games.


DOES IT DECREASE PERFORMANCE?
Nope, reads like clockwork, the in-game movies are smooth as can be.


ANY NOTICABLE EFFECTS?
The pitch of the lens is much lower when the tracking resistor is applied, showing smoother movement. No more of the sharp metally noises when reading CDgames.


NUMBERS:
So considering that the impedance between the points where resistors are applied is definitely above 60kohms, we can say that the voltage on its way from the I/O to the s!pwm does not drop to less than 60k/62k=97% when no resistor is applied. So that is as good as still 100%.
When the 3k9 focus resistor is applied, the voltage drops to 3k9/5k9=66%.
When the 510 tracking resistor is applied, the voltage drops to 510/2510=20%.

So if the full range on the opamp input were the full range on the output, the max power on the coils would drop to:
focus: .66^2=44%
tracking: .2^2=4%

COMMENTS:
The difference between the allowable limiting of the focus signal compared to the tracking signal is 10x!!!
That is why the s!pwm could not stomach the vin reduced to 5v as when performing the romeo mod in one of the first proposed fixes.
In the v9 syndrome mostly tracking coils blew. Can anyone verify this is the case here as well?
Beacause if it is, then we can reduce the fix even further to just 1 resistor on the tracking channel!

[Thinkdiff]

could you post an install image or just a picture of the board with the points that need to be modded? Sounds like a very interesting fix.

[summ0ne]

here you go
(had a wrong one there for 5min, sorry - down again)

[modordie]

please keep us posted ; )

and... will this method prevent anything from the Psu end?


tnx,


nooclles

[XcalibEr]

hmmm......it sound like they just reversed engineered the matrix team work. Matrix Team put everything in layman's terms rather then engineering terms. They just put engineering terms in replacement andc released details that way, no new data from them.

BTW, I would just add a 10k 25V POT in line from tke power supply and drop down to the safe 8.1 as pointed out by Gradius. POT allows fine tuning :p Or has anyone taken aprt the power supplies ( 8.5V and 9.2 V ) and seen a difference in parts. We all know big corporations use multiple manufacturers, maybe one manufacturer swapped out part due to supply and demand or used faulty device.

A simple circuit can be made, a DC male connector, one side POT to centre connector, middle connector POT to center on DC female connector, and outside both DC connectors to each other. Place POT at 1/2 way and plug cord into outlet and adjust till voltage at 8.1V then tape up so no loose wires or shorts and you should be good to go and hook up to PStwo. You coudl even do on a circuit board and all LED's if wanted.

way using pot if u can use voltage regulator.
Just connect the voltage regulator inline with the power suply, and u got 8V output voltage.

If the 7805 can handle the currend drawn by the ps2, then we have a winner :)

if not we need to search for one who can handle upto 5a.
I'll check the info about the 7808. :-pray:

[XcalibEr]

From what i found the 7808 can handle upto 1A.
I also found info about another regulator:

"LD1585C SERIES
5A LOW DROPOUT FAST RESPONSE POSITIVE VOLTAGE REGULATOR ADJUSTABLE AND FIXED"

it could be it :)

that was just a fast google search.
given the time, i bet there is 3 pin fixed 8V 5A regulator.

[XcalibEr]

I wonder from whom they ripped those info.... :lol: :lol: :lol:

Why u keep blamming the ripper team of ripping matrix team.
From what i read from this document, the ripper team r doing a good job reverse enjeniring.

And thay gave us a new poing of view, that all this could be due for a missing SysCon on version 9 and on.

All the matrix team sayed it could be power suply issue, thay never sayed anything about missing SysCon, so where is the ripp-off.

Give them a credit for there fine job. :mad:

Don't get me wrong, we need also thnx the matrix team for there contribution for solving this problem and for the amaizing infinity :D

[Unununium]

Now I just need to get them two resistors and the balls to install them. Steady hands steady hands.

[spedmetal]

Its been a while since the Magic team had anything new to say in the PS2 scene, but have a look at what they had to say about the V12 problem on November 19 posted on there official web site. Kind of controversial if you ask me. If this isnt news here sorry for posting about it again. Just thought it to be very interesting as to what they had to say about all this BS.

Here is a link to their site http://www.china-magic.com/

[anarchy2007]

Just put a 5kOhms +/- 5% resistor on +V (must be on +V) output should do the job.

The colors are: Green, Black, Red and Gold.

Gradius

If it is the PSU's output that you are talking about, I don't think this will work since you'll have a bit of a problem finding a 50 Watt resistor.

About the ripper team; I wouldn't trust to much that they have to say, check their first theory on the v9 syndrome (Faulty coils and lenses), Further more they sold a "flash-upgardable" chip, and they never released not one flash for it, and then just closed their website (ripper2.com). In my opinion they are a bunch of lamers. If you think they ripped it from the Matrix team you are most propebly correct.

[tjuddi]

Qouting China-Magic "Therefore, we must honestly conclude that the so called v12 compatible modchips on the market today are the cause of the "burn out" problem.

The magic team will ALWAYS tell you true facts .......and give you the solutions........."

If this should be true we must conclude that there has never been a faulty v9 with magicV fitted? Can anyone confirm this?

[modordie]

those fuking retards cant even type a straight sentence. wtf? ITS A NEWS UPDATE! you would think they might run spellchecker on that fuk... lmao


noocllez,...

[fx0d]

RIpper team updated their page http://www.ripper3.com/v12_DEAD_BEEF_070.pdf

[XcalibEr]

Qouting China-Magic "Therefore, we must honestly conclude that the so called v12 compatible modchips on the market today are the cause of the "burn out" problem.

The magic team will ALWAYS tell you true facts .......and give you the solutions........."

If this should be true we must conclude that there has never been a faulty v9 with magicV fitted? Can anyone confirm this?

At first when i've installed magic 5k on v9 i didn't had even 1 faulty ps2.
When i started to used other chips i had some.

Actully the first one was from Infinity chip :(

Don't know if it says much since it could be coincedence.

[Chip&Chop]

RIpper team updated their page http://www.ripper3.com/v12_DEAD_BEEF_070.pdf
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
I never read so much crap in all my life...

How is possible to belive to people whose only job until now has been the ripping other teams work without adding anything to the scene?
What kind of skill can these guys have?

Ripper2---> ripped from ***3
Ripper3---> ripped from Matrix

These guys are funny :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


As for Magic Team, I witnessed two V12 die in front of my eyes without modchip and one with erratic behaviours.
Other collegues near our shop witnessed the same death without modchip, and other modders on this board experienced the same issue.
Maybe they simply got lucky not to find a bad PSTWO, or maybe the one sent here in Europe were coming from a different $ony factory, but as long as someone will explain me how a bad code into a modchip can make the laser of an UNMODDED PSTWO to blow up, I will just consider these news releases a loss of time.

Chip&Chop

[foundmy]

C&C: well, its really simply, a modchip can be close to a unmodded pstwo unit. SO tell your buddy not to play an unmodded pstwo with a modchip near by.. :-)

but they did point out thou, that static can effect it, that can be true, but i would think things like the fuse would blow first before allowing noise into the ps2. but i could be wrong.

We have ran a DVD-RW movie on a unmodded PSTWO for 24 hrs straight repeating with our own kind of fix in a PSTWO, and no problems. plus playing original GTA:SA for the other 24 hrs as well, nothing dead so far. we will most likely put in a chip and see what it does after that and do the same testing again...

[Chip&Chop]

C&C: well, its really simply, a modchip can be close to a unmodded pstwo unit. SO tell your buddy not to play an unmodded pstwo with a modchip near by.. :-)

Right, i never tought about that.... :lol: :lol:

I will start to keep my modchip into the safe in the other room of the store everytime i will test a PSTWO from now on !!!!!
:lol: :lol:

Chip&Chop

[GlenC]

Both of my ps two's died on disc changes, ran fine for 48 hours playing a disc continuously. It seems to me to be a reset or disc change that is killing them.

Maybe you should knock up a circuit that resets the ps two every few minutes, and see if it's still going 24 hours later. It seems to me to be the initial disc authentication that is causing the problems.

Glen.

[Tatsh]

In such case, would removal of authentication through CD/DVD (using modchip) patching help to solve some of the problem?

[BST Console]

Both of my ps two's died on disc changes, ran fine for 48 hours playing a disc continuously. It seems to me to be a reset or disc change that is killing them.

Maybe you should knock up a circuit that resets the ps two every few minutes, and see if it's still going 24 hours later. It seems to me to be the initial disc authentication that is causing the problems.

Glen.


Ah, Yes. Im seeing the same thing here. My first PStwo ran 100 hours without interuption just fine. It was only after a few resets (50?) that it blew a fuse and no A/V.
The second PStwo I tested for 50+ hours and about 20 resets B4 I installed the chip, it was fine after that for about another 20 power-ups. Then no disc spin. I havent had a burnt laser yet tho. Just different fuses going.

[BST Console]

I like what Im reading here

http://www.infinitymod.com/cgi-bin/matrix/site.pl

[drewid]

yes, lets hope its the one :D

[darkmaster2]

looking good! Where can one get a PIC programmer in the UK?

[TeknoZ]

google for : 12c508 programmer site:.co.uk
Second hit there is one for 12 UKP, or if you want to build a cheap one google for jdm programmer.

Me think will test this tomorrow ;)

[ZootAllures]

Software on my Pic Programmer from the old days says BAD HEXFILE. Is this hex protected?

Here is the code
:0800000000250CC000020CFF00060CFA09630CFA7C
:0800080009630CFA09630CFA096306660A2D0CFAF7
:08001000096306660A2D0CFA096306660A2D0CFABE
:08001800096306660A2D0CFA096306660A2D0CFAB6
:08002000096306660A2D0CFA096306660A2D0CFAAE
:08002800096306660A2D0CFA0963000406660A2DA8
:0800300006660A2D06660A2D06660A2D06660A2D3C
:0800380006660A2D06660A2D06660A2D06660A2D34
:0800400006660A2D0CC800320C01096306660A2DF3
:0800480002F20A4406660A2D06660A2D06660A2D85
:0800500006660A2D06660A2D06660A2D06660A2D1C
:0800580006660A2D06660A2D06660A2D0CFB00268A
:08006000000600040A6100300CFA0031000402F1C5
:040068000A6602F00A640800BC
:010FFF000FEEF4
:00000001FF


Don't the fuses and watchdog and clock need to be configured or is it built into the hex? I was using a 12c508a

[loy]

This is so true "Further analysis on several V12 has shown that in certain situations the mechanics controller can fail while
communicating with the dvd controller.
You can notice when this happens since the reset button, which is connected to the mechanics controller,
will stop responding and the only way to turn off the machine is to unplug the power jack."

[KaISeR SoZEi]

*******4 use two pin for O ( = A ) -> good
Messiah2 use two pin for A -> good
*******3 use one pin for O -> bad...
Matrix infinity use one pin for O -> bad...

Ripper2 use....ONE pin for A -> hum.... interresting :D

[OttawaMods.com]

am i reading right? when you're playing a game, if the chip sees too much voltage going to the controller then it'll power off the ps2? interesting fix..

[foundmy]

yes, the unit will i believe reset... which causes everything to be reset....

[OttawaMods.com]

im just wondering will 1n914 workin place of the 1n4148?

[Thinkdiff]

Yes, they are the same diode. The box I got from radioshack said 1N914, but the diodes themselves even said 4148 on them.

[murcielago]

Matrix Team says:
-----------------------------
Further analysis on several V12 has shown that in certain situations the mechanics controller can fail while
communicating with the dvd controller.
You can notice when this happens since the reset button, which is connected to the mechanics controller,
will stop responding and the only way to turn off the machine is to unplug the power jack.

When the mechanics controller crashes, the dvd controller keeps sending a pulse train to the tracking and
focus drivers which results in a steady voltage increase on both the tracking and the focus coils.
With the proposed diode fix, this increase is initially limited but if the user leaves the crashed pstwo on for
several seconds the output drivers will eventually reach saturation and, if the RS2004FS thermal protection
doesn't kick in, the coils can burn from the increased current flowing.
-----------------------------------------

Ripper team says :
------------------------------------------
In our opinion the cause of all failures starting from V9 and ending up with V12 is
CD/DVD DSP processor lockup! CD/DVD DSP simply fails to start executing code from
the beginning or it is locked up later during normal operation when the boot process
takes place.

CD/DVD controller and maybe Mechacon fails to initialize during power on, it
locks up during normal operation by strong electromagnetic field produced by
spindle motor or by spikes on power lines caused by the motor, or it locks up
during the patching of CD/DVD bus by a modchip.

If DSP is locked then it will require total power OFF and
power ON. Normally simple reset will not help. (If your cell phone gets locked, you
must remove battery). The best idea (as we think now) is to disable power circuit.
--------------------------------------------


So both Teams says the same thing if Playstation get locked doesn't matter if had modchip or not need to turn off machine so best solution i think is the matrix fix with the pic12c508 i will go on and test.

For those who ask before fuses are Int_RC , wdt ON, mclr_OFF ;)

[XcalibEr]

At last the sh*t is floating into the surface :(

Many moths ago i was told by a very respectible member of this forum what is cosing to the v9 simptom, and since no one talked about it, i thought maby it was just another theory.

Whell it goas like this:
Until version 7 (including) there was eeprom wich contains all the initioation info in it and it was outside of the SysCon, and it had a backup withing the SysCon.

From V9 the outside eeprom was removed and the initioation was made from the one inside the SysCon, in that case in the bootup when the ps2 tried to read the data from the DVD/CD bus, the data is corruped by the chip which is trying to patch it and which is connected trough this lines.

that what i was told if i remeber correctly.

but if the ripper team right and the SysCon was removed then probebly the eeprom was moved into the DSP wich make it more resnable to be corrpeted while it goes trogh the 8bit databus between the MechCon and the DSP again where the chip is connected.

so, in that case, if the initioation data is corraped that could be the reason for the MechCon to lock up and coils to burn!!! (all the 12C508 does it to prevent the MechCon to lockup and kill the coils)

The chipping companies didn't want us to know that there chips are making this problem, cose it probebly involved in redesign the chip, so thay made us belive to the low quality ps2's sindrom.

How many times after install we withnes a strange problems like the power led is turn on and the the ps2 refused to shut down until we unplag it? and when we do it there is a strange click sound (if u listen cerfully).

all the problems ware cosed since the chips ware paching what that wasn't supposed to-be patched.

read cerfully between the lines of what magic team, ripper team and also the matrix team are saying.

the 12c508 is not a solution!!! its not the cure, it's just the pill to reduce the head-ake or to ease the pain!!!

what we really need is a chip that don't kill ps2's insted of addons to prevent it from killing ps2s.

just my opinion...

To all the chip industry out there, please give us something THAT WORKS!

[kenzo]

i am also not sure about this fix.

OK i unterstand what the pic should do, but

what is when i have a PSTwo with this syndrom, will the ps2 always reset?
this is no solution.
i cannot use it or could this only be happen 1 time/month

it must than be a broken pstwo when the PIC do his job


?!?!?!

[foundmy]

well, shortly we will be testing more things with teh solution we are working on.
We have been running a PSTWO with no chip just our kind of fix with a movie on dvdrw on repeat, playing games all originals and all original movies no problem. I even scratched a DVDRW up so there would be skipping and such. It even froze on a frame, stayed on that frame for 30mins until i came by and pressed "NEXT CHAPTER". but shortly we will put in a chip and see what happens and see if our fix stands up to the test. If it does, that will be nice. but probably another week or so until we feel confortable to start bundling any v12 chip with the our fix parts.

-------
The Matrix PIC Fix, i believe that is will turn off or reset the ps2 unit if it detects a databus hang. its more to prevent the coils from being burnt out than a solution. but atleast they are trying different things.

[Chip&Chop]

It's good to see people working on these issues and sharing informations and solutions.

I read all their results and this indeed explains why unmodded PSTWO burn up during reset or while playing dvd's that are intensive on the mechanic side of the DVD laser.
It also explains the behaviour of the burned PSTWO that we saw in our shop.

I will give it a try in the coming days with a couple of PSTWO just to put it under test. I am sure i still have a 12c508 programmer somewhere at home :p


Chip&Chop

[Chip&Chop]

well, shortly we will be testing more things with teh solution we are working on.
We have been running a PSTWO with no chip just our kind of fix with a movie on dvdrw on repeat, playing games all originals and all original movies no problem. I even scratched a DVDRW up so there would be skipping and such. It even froze on a frame, stayed on that frame for 30mins until i came by and pressed "NEXT CHAPTER". but shortly we will put in a chip and see what happens and see if our fix stands up to the test. If it does, that will be nice. but probably another week or so until we feel confortable to start bundling any v12 chip with the our fix parts.

-------
The Matrix PIC Fix, i believe that is will turn off or reset the ps2 unit if it detects a databus hang. its more to prevent the coils from being burnt out than a solution. but atleast they are trying different things.


Foundmy, I will be waiting your fix too to test it ;)

Chip&Chop

[Chip&Chop]

The chipping companies didn't want us to know that there chips are making this problem, cose it probebly involved in redesign the chip, so thay made us belive to the low quality ps2's sindrom.

Ok, explain UNMODDED dead PSTWO than....

It's getting really boring to keep seeing people complainig on the modchips for any kind of shit that is going on into the PS2/PSTWO :mad:

We already faced this with old V9/V10 LA issue when everyone was blaiming the modchip prducers.
Let's try to evolve our minds and to give responsability of this shit to who deserve it.... $ONY.


Chip&Chop.

[modordie]

Chip&Chop:

F'in A MAN!!!


ALL U CRYBABIES... STFU! Ripper..? wtf r they? if you ask me, they showed up a few days before TI released what looks like the begging to a final solution. I dont care WTF they are saying, they got caught on lies before, now they try to jump in on the v12 shit right b4 it actually gets solved. whaaann! whannn! cry babbies... stfu and listen to TI! at least they know how to use spell checker when they release a statement on their site...


LMAO...

bout to try this method out..

piece...


noocllez...

[modordie]

Ok,

1. whats the difficulty rating on building a PIC programmer?

2. are there any cheap USA places online that carry USB or Parallel PIC programmers for the 12C508? if so, please post LINKS! ;]

3. how exactly do you hook this programmer up to the 12C508, do you have to solder wires each time you want to flash a different PIC?


tnx, hope to get responses to these questions [IM SURE ALOT OF OTHERS WOULD TOO ;]


noocllez...

[XcalibEr]

Ok, explain UNMODDED dead PSTWO than....

It's getting really boring to keep seeing people complainig on the modchips for any kind of shit that is going on into the PS2/PSTWO :mad:

We already faced this with old V9/V10 LA issue when everyone was blaiming the modchip prducers.
Let's try to evolve our minds and to give responsability of this shit to who deserve it.... $ONY.


Chip&Chop.

I didn't say the ps2 is perfect, and there is no proof for u'r stating that the PsTwo is dieing without a chip.

faulty ps2 could be here and there, but massive dead ps2's as happend on v9 and v12 is duo to installtion of a chip.

I'm allway checking the ps2's before installtion, and one time a ps2 which i tested it and saw it working, dided couple of seconds after installing infinity while booting it (boot succeeded).

Don't change the subject, read what matrix/magic/ripper wrote. the probelm is happening when the machcontrol fail to init , when it loads it's initioation data.

it's easy to blame it on sony, right..
What a fucked up PS2 not working with a chip in it :D

Maby the riper team riped from matrix, and maby not, but thay are ppl who know there buisness. and u can tell it from reading the documents thay published.

And before i've installed infinity on a v9 or duo 2 se i didn't had even one falty v9.

now when i'm installing infinity and duo, i allways do the romeo mod.
but the fact that the romeo mod "fix" the broblem, don't releases the modchip companys from there duty to support a chip that don't need fixing.

the matrix team don't state black-on-white that it's the chip that cosing the problem, what did u expect??

"hello dear customers, sorry to inform u that all this time and all those dead ps2 where becose you've istalled our amazing chip" :crazy:

[modordie]

"Hopefully" a Moderator sees all this garbage you are spewing in the WRONG THREAD....

WE ARE NOT HERE TO DEBATE THIS, THIS THREAD IS FOR "SOLVING THE PSTWO PROBLEMS". YOU ARE JUST MAKING THIS THREAD HARDER TO READ FOR PEOPLE TRYING TO FOLLOW ALONG WITH STUFF THAT ACTUALLY MATERS. PLZ, GO SPOUT OFF IN A DIFFERENT THREAD.

[GlenC]

Hi,

Is anyone else getting a checksum error with the hex code that the matrix team supplied.

My programmer just rejects it.

Glen.

[GameOne]

Untill now, since i have made the 1st matrix fix with 1n4148 diodes, i haven´t problens with the lens
no.. i lie, i have problens with one, but is shit head customer that was using golden dvd discs... bad quality media

all the others customers and me are using DVD ritek, 1x recorded and no problens

somebody did record a PIC 12c508 eeprom with the new matrix fix... if did, post impressions!

[ZootAllures]

That HEX file is no good! Keep coming up with errors when trying to load it into the software for the PIC programmer.

[xcode]

just recorded a 12c508a with ICprog 1.05C and a JDM programmer all ok, will try it in a PStwo tomorrow :-pray:

[Albert35]

Burnd a Pic 12c508 with matrix code using ICprog other programs came up with errors.
Maybe its the type of hex code used.
Oke builded one in a PStwo without a problem..
Some day's ago I found a way to easy let crash a PStwo.
It switched off perfectly afther 2sec.

Here's how you can test youre PIC12C508

Upgrade youre infinity chip with a CD to version 1.38
If youre Infinity has already V1.38 no problem just update it again.
Afther update remove CD and place DVD game "Matrix reloaded"
Press 1 time short the eject button.
Youre PStwo will crash.
If PIC12C508 is working PStwo switches of in a few seconds If PIC is not working laser will burn in a few seconds

[modordie]

god dammit, we have to make a JDM? wtf... so much for "quick and easy to find part"...

any decent US vendor selling these online?


I do see a TON of them on ebug and most of them say they function with the 12C508. But, i dont see how they connect to the PIC itself...?

thnx,


modordie...

[tjuddi]

I found a way to easy let crash a PStwo.
It switched off perfectly afther 2sec.

Here's how you can test youre PIC12C508

Upgrade youre infinity chip with a CD to version 1.38
If youre Infinity has already V1.38 no problem just update it again.
Afther update remove CD and place DVD game "Matrix reloaded"
Press 1 time short the eject button.
Youre PStwo will crash.
If PIC12C508 is working PStwo switches of in a few seconds If PIC is not working laser will burn in a few seconds

If This is true isnt it evidence enough that the chips kills the Machines???
Is this also the reason for the v9 consoles failures also?

[GlenC]

Hi,

I've think I've found a way to get the hex into a usable form for 12c508 programmers that dont accept the matrix hex file as it stands.

Get hold of the free copy of icprog, load the matrix hex in, then immediately save it back out again to a different filename.

This file will now load into my programmer software without error. I've disasembled the output file (I couldn't do this with the original file due to the errors) and the code appears to be perfectly valid.

Just need a ps two to test it on now...uk seems to not have any in the shops anywhere.

Hope this helps anyone who cannot program the original hex.

Glen.

[Albert35]

This is not proof modchip will burn youre PStwo
Remember new unmodded PS2 die also with same burnout of laser..
This is onlye a way to create an error an let youre PS2 crash. A scratch on a DVD or CD can do the same thing but is more intermittent than this way..

[tjuddi]

This is not proof modchip will burn youre PStwo
Remember new unmodded PS2 die also with same burnout of laser..


How is this proved? i should believe if a new concole fails it will be brung back to vendor and not opened by the owner to miss warranty?

who can really confirm a fleet of broken PSTWO unmodded?

I have a new unused here how can i break it? burn a movie on dvd-rw and reset every 5 min?

[summ0ne]

I thought the same on v9s.
Tested every v9 24h with exploit+divx - none died.
installed chip -> died within 40s.

I think that the ps2 reads much faster with chip installed since it gets data from the mod and authorises faster. That is why on every v9 only tracking coils blew.

So if i limit the tracking signal so it can barely read media:
If it does not die reading media - it will NEVER die, even during a mechacon crash.

Here is my fix in action - single 560ohm resistor on tracking input - hasnt died yet :-) and the pstwo is much quieter, no scratchy noises ;-)
http://d-vices.com/install/s0-v12-ff.jpg
http://d-vices.com/install/s0-v12-fc.jpg

[ZootAllures]

Thanks GlenC Now the hex works just have to put in a console now!

[kenzo]

how can we test the PIC in a pstwo if it works corect?

any ideas?

[Albert35]

Read a few messages back there is it explained.

[psxgameshop]

I will try SummOne's fix with resistors

psxgameshop

[psxgameshop]

I have just seen the pictures. SummOne what happened with 3,9 Kohm resistor.

psxgameshop

[summ0ne]

i think that the 560ohm on the tracking is enough.
i reduced the fix to just 1 resistor, i will keep u posted about any fried lasers (if i get one) ;-)

[psxgameshop]

OK ! I will try it.

Thanks SummOne

psxgameshop

[flashharry]

with the dispute over the pstwo being faulty or not before modding why the hell is it the shops in the uk got no stock? Some have been out of stock within days of the initial release of the new pstwo, gotta say sounds more like $ony went back to the drawing board with this one & delayed further shipments. Since xmas 2001 stocks have been plentifull in all retailers so why not this year? $ony are not that stupid they did not make enough with there experiece (or maybe they are) please don't say bloggs & co have stock what i mean is the mainstream retailers who rely on xmas have not had stock for a couple of weeks & are quoting a further 2 weeks for next delivery....quality control problems you think?

[aqua]

I programmed 12c508 no probs with Matrix's hex file, installed usiny 1500 ohms resistor, and the machine does not switch on, not even the red led lights up, changed resistor to 2000ohms and all is ok. Cant get the console to crash so as to test this.

Anyone had similar probs with 1500 resistor, tested on Pal pstwo scph-70004

[Gradius]

We have ran a DVD-RW movie on a unmodded PSTWO for 24 hrs straight repeating with our own kind of fix in a PSTWO, and no problems. plus playing original GTA:SA for the other 24 hrs as well, nothing dead so far. we will most likely put in a chip and see what it does after that and do the same testing again...

DVD-RW (DVD-Video mode) isn't good as a base tests, since as DVD-Video standard say, it read DVD-R/RW medias in DVD-Video mode @ 1x only (1x = realtime or 10.08Mbps max).

DVD-R/RW games (PS2 games) read it in higher speed (@ 4x).

Gradius

[Gradius]

If it is the PSU's output that you are talking about, I don't think this will work since you'll have a bit of a problem finding a 50 Watt resistor.

I did a real test on my 1000mA (or 1kVA) @ 12V power supply using a regular 5kOhm resistor, and works perfectly. I really never care about wattage at all, resistor is just a resistor (for low voltages as 12V or less, this doesn't counts).

Gradius

[summ0ne]

I did a real test on my 1000mA (or 1kVA) @ 12V power supply using a regular 5kOhm resistor, and works perfectly. I really never care about wattage at all, resistor is just a resistor (for low voltages as 12V or less, this doesn't counts).

Gradius

a 5k resistor is nothing. Its as if there was no resistor. at 8.5v it only lets thru 1.7mA.

If u used it like suggested it would be on 8.7-8.5V=0.2V letting thru 40uA.

so if u have a 340uW psTwo, then ure set ;-)
(now where does all that nasty heat come from... it must have a backup nuclear reactor then... hehe)


The pstwo has to be connected and running when u measure voltage, u know

[plazma]

Theres a new fix for V12.
http://vandrunen.net/gallery/PSTwo_vanDrunen_Fix
http://web02063.prolocation.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3371&start=60

I guess this fix combined with Matrix Pic fix would be the best solution so far
http://www.infinitymod.com/cgi-bin/matrix/site.pl?page=laserv12

I will test these fixes todays.

[Unununium]

That fix is way out of my league to be doing, i'll mess something up. Hopefully I can get someone else to do it for me. Just to be sure, is this fix needed on consoles that aren't modded?

[kenzo]

is there NO WAY to test if the chip is programmed ok
and installed ok in the PSTwo ?????

The original HEX File is not in the right format for original PIC Programmers from MICROCHIP

If you open it first in ICPROG and save it than ou can open it in MBLAB from MICROCHIP

but

Fuse settings?

and what is the right CHECKSUMM !!!???

[modordie]

i cant belive no one has posted links for respectable sites that sell both the PIC and Programmer....?


its becoming apparent that people who are getting this done DO NOT care about others that may not know everything about this type procedure...

WTF? post your results and instructions on what you guys did to get it working... just look at the post above this one, most of these ppl have NO IDEA what to do to get it working... All it takes is one person to write a 10line tutorial and post it on here...

come on now ;]

[kima]

i cant belive no one has posted links for respectable sites that sell both the PIC and Programmer....?


its becoming apparent that people who are getting this done DO NOT care about others that may not know everything about this type procedure...

WTF? post your results and instructions on what you guys did to get it working... just look at the post above this one, most of these ppl have NO IDEA what to do to get it working... All it takes is one person to write a 10line tutorial and post it on here...

come on now ;]

Have you tryed google ??
PIC's and programmers are availble everywhere as DIY and in shops.

Fuse settings : WDT ON, MCLR OFF

Kim A

[modordie]

of course, but have you? there are about 1000 different ones out there... TI should have at least recommended which software and programmer to use...

[XcalibEr]

I thought the same on v9s.
Tested every v9 24h with exploit+divx - none died.
installed chip -> died within 40s.

I think that the ps2 reads much faster with chip installed since it gets data from the mod and authorises faster. That is why on every v9 only tracking coils blew.

So if i limit the tracking signal so it can barely read media:
If it does not die reading media - it will NEVER die, even during a mechacon crash.

Here is my fix in action - single 560ohm resistor on tracking input - hasnt died yet :-) and the pstwo is much quieter, no scratchy noises ;-)
http://d-vices.com/install/s0-v12-ff.jpg
http://d-vices.com/install/s0-v12-fc.jpg

the chip is killing the ps2s, it has nothing to do with reading speed!!!
the chips are corrapting the eeprom data wile patching.

There are some ppl of intrest who try to make us belive that it's $ony fault, and that unmoded are dieing the same as moded one, it's just a B*LL..

I personally never had a v9 which dide without a chip, period.
And i had one that died 30 second after install, in wich i played with hem and also run a movie befor the instal.

Be serius, how objective a chip company can be in this matter?

[kima]

of course, but have you? there are about 1000 different ones out there... TI should have at least recommended which software and programmer to use...

icprog 1.05C and JMD programmer is an EASY solution. and works fine..

The programmer takes 1 hour in the LAB to fabricate, and every electronic shop has 12C508. In Europe use www.farnell.com , www.RS-components.com etc.

[kenzo]

why buy extra for this a programmer

you will get the complete programmed chip about ? 2-3


but there are many unclear factors:
HEX is not in MICROCHIP Format
Checksumm is unknown?
settings?

and no way to test it in a PSTwo

new informationms are welcome

[Unununium]

the chip is killing the ps2s, it has nothing to do with reading speed!!!
the chips are corrapting the eeprom data wile patching.

There are some ppl of intrest who try to make us belive that it's $ony fault, and that unmoded are dieing the same as moded one, it's just a B*LL..

I personally never had a v9 which dide without a chip, period.
And i had one that died 30 second after install, in wich i played with hem and also run a movie befor the instal.

Be serius, how objective a chip company can be in this matter?


So your saying that my unmodded system shouldn't stop reading discs because of a power failure? What i'm trying to figure out is if my system has no modchip in it, is it even somewhat nessesary to apply one of these fixed? Is it a badly contructed console that will die after so many resets or does it only mess up after a chip is installed?

[modordie]

the chip is killing the ps2s, it has nothing to do with reading speed!!!
the chips are corrapting the eeprom data wile patching.

There are some ppl of intrest who try to make us belive that it's $ony fault, and that unmoded are dieing the same as moded one, it's just a B*LL..


HAAA.. READ ALL THESE REVIEWS AT EBGAMES AND TELL ME WHY 50% OF THEM HAVE DEAD PSTWO'S??? oh wait... Ebgames must have seen that and changed the format... LMFAO... ur a sucker...

[modordie]

i see a ton of PIC programmers [here: http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=PIC+Programmer&hl=en&lr=&sa=N&tab=ff&oi=froogler] and i'm pretty sure they will all work with the 12C508 [please correct me if i am wrong].

should we stay away from USB, or is there any common problems with USB PIC flashing?

tnx,


noocllez

[anarchy2007]

MODORDIE, UNUNUNIUM & EXCALIBER.

I believe there is some truth in what excaliber is saying, but not in all cases. In some cases it might be certain chips, but most definately not in all. If the chips do corrupt the bios, then why when a 5v mod is done on the v9 - 11 consoles there are no more dead LA6508 or lenses????

Why don't you post all the diffirent "dead" consoles that you have had with their respective chips here http://www.ps2newz.net/forums/showthread.php?t=29250 , and then we can see for our selfs which chips, media or console give the most problems. I detailed ever chip that I have done on v9 onwards with the amount of consoles damaged.

[modordie]

if your in North America, having troubles finding a PIC programmer [that works with ICProg] or dont want to build your own....

Buy from these guys: https://store.qkits.com/moreinfo.cfm/QK96

Great on the phone for answering questions and nice prices too ; ]

[if you are going to be continually flashing with this kit, get the ZIF adapter ;]


noocllez...

[kenzo]

we havenow installed the PIC in a Pstwo with diodefix

the pstwo runs without any problems

but before we had also no problems

so no ideas if it is a good protection or not

[tjuddi]

Where are THE GUYS designing/producing the chips now?
i cannot believe that no one of them are regular members of this scene?
They as makers should be answering these questions?

And plz can anyone tell us who to trust? All this shit about the *** team, Ripper team, Messiah team, China-magic team and so on.

[BST Console]

Update at the matrix page
http://www.infinitymod.com/cgi-bin/matrix/site.pl?page=news

Testing options posted!!

[XcalibEr]

HAAA.. READ ALL THESE REVIEWS AT EBGAMES AND TELL ME WHY 50% OF THEM HAVE DEAD PSTWO'S??? oh wait... Ebgames must have seen that and changed the format... LMFAO... ur a sucker...

Cose ppl are liers, thay are trying to install a chip in the ps2 and then reattaching the lable and returning it as it was never oppend.

What did u expect them to say? "sorry my ps2 dide on me while i was trying to install a chip on it, please replace it".

Here and there it could be defective ps2s, i agree.
and a low quality media will kill the lens (in long period of time) but certnly not in 30 second.

The matrix fix is actully a confession of them that there chip is not PERFECT and it coasing the MechCon to get locked. and it's agreed on them and on ripper team that when the mechcon get locked it cosing the axtra current though the lens coils and burning them.

I saw alot of ps2 get locked after modding and there is no way to shut them down unless u get the power off.

UNTIL NOW I'VE NEVER SEEN OR HEARD OF AN UNMODED PS2 WHICH GOT LOCKED!! :crazy:

[Pimpmastah]

How stupid is this going to become?! I imagine myself standing in front of my customer who just bought a modded PS2 telling him:"Hey, congratulatoins on purchasing this safe PS2. It is safe, the laser won't burn and it even won't lock, but when you play a game it could hapen that it turns off automatically. Possibly after 2 hours, possibly after 10 minutes, nobody knows.... anyway have fun playing with your safe PS2"

On the theoretical side of things the fix with the PIC is nearly perfect but on the realistic side.. nah that's nuts.

Ripper-Team has updated their dead-beef documentation, they are now at v0.95. It looks interesting but I dont understand a word of what they say - too hardcore... can somebody please translate this?

[Chip&Chop]

I personally never had a v9 which dide without a chip, period.
And i had one that died 30 second after install, in wich i played with hem and also run a movie befor the instal.


Than probably you should learn how to mod properly a PS2.

We made more than 600 PS2 V9/V10 since last October in our shop, and guess what, only 4 dead (without Romeo mod).
And guess what also? we are installing any kind of modchip if customer brings it.

Too bad they deleted the old threads with lot of reports of unmodded V12 blowing up, and too bad you didn't read anyone of them.....
You should really spend more time reading the forum before posting.

Chip&Chop.

P.S.: I personally witnessed two PSTWO die after few minutes of work UNMODDED, period.

[Chip&Chop]

Cose ppl are liers, thay are trying to install a chip in the ps2 and then reattaching the lable and returning it as it was never oppend.

What did u expect them to say? "sorry my ps2 dide on me while i was trying to install a chip on it, please replace it".

:lol: :lol: :lol:
This is ridiculous, it really looks like you have no idea of what you are talking about.

By the way, did you read this thread of anarchy2007:
http://www.ps2newz.net/forums/showthread.php?t=29250

Is he also a liar just becouse he had 4 unmodded PS2 dead with burned LA and 6 unmodded PS2 with dead lasers in the last month?
Am I a liar just becouse I saw two PSTWO died unmodded?
Other respected members on this and other forum reported unmodded PS2/PSTWO deaths. Are we all liars?
But most important of all, who are you to tell us that we are all liars? :mad:

Grow up.

Chip&Chop

[Robbiee]

Hmmm, it seams that there is a very thin line between bullshiting and...
Well, I think that some forum members that might seem contributive, are actually, Sonys people, which poison the scene with "elaborated" desinformations about PStwo and PS2. If I were Sony I would act just like that. You may say that it is conspiracy theory, though, I would name it just - conspiracy!

[ahennings]

Is there any difference between the 12C508 and 12C508a.

[foundmy]

aheenings: don't worry its all good 12c508/12c508a it will work on both.

--------
more update results:
We have a installer testing out a CC with a v12 running GTA:SA on a DVDRW and so far, so good. yes, the issue with the bus is correct as Matrix team pointed out and also Ripper team does explain how the coils are getting fried 100% true.

Reducing the voltage does allow the laser to last longer, i think we can all agree but do use good media please! but its not a solution, we removed the spike (or large part of the spike) on the coils from boot up, but that is not 100% solution. but being able to control the bus will be what we are after ourselves.

The latest ripper team info explains the time delay needed, that is true, but what about ingame bus hanging, then what? i just stated that as a question to show there is so much more to be worried about.

I think we (and the community as a whole) are getting close...

once we do more testing and we feel our solution is proper enough that your machine won't have to be turned off if the bus is hung (which was nice of the matrix team to find the interrupt line ---nice R&D).

once we finished testing it out in more machines,then, and only then, will we be offer it up. There is just so much time in the day right now, and with a limited amount of people working at it, or any other solutions...

How many other resellers/installers are playing or trying differnet things as a fix, not enough. Come on, play a bit, you guys are making money, so what if you blow up 5 PSTWOS lasers trying things, its not like you are not going to be able to get your money back from doing v12 installs or selling v12 chips.

[darkmaster2]

any hints on what your fix involves Foundmy? Pic chip a bit like matrix?
I hope ye all get it sorted before Xmas :)

[minos197]

First of all guys please.We are getting out of the point.This is not a thread for whether moding is bad or who is responsible.This is about FIXING the issue.

-XcalibEr.I try to understand what is your point and why do you try so hard to accuse the mod scene?Suppose you are right.In that case a therory is that Sony could have hidden some code or minor flaws to the new consoles design to burn when modded.They could also withdstand some innocent pleople frying their lasers with unmodded consoles.But even this is true would me or you or anybody else veryfy it?This is marketing policy that is kept secret.It is poinless to keep arguing about that.

I believe we should not accuse Matrix Team or Ripper Team but thank then for trying to resolve this issue.Even if their theories seem the same item with different approach.Even if the mod(any mod) may be partially held responsible for the failure we all know it and are willing to take the chances of that.The same thing happened any in the old days that PS1 laser did not fry but wear out easier when modded.It is the same as smoking.You know it can kill you but if you want to do I am not the one to forbit you or blame the tobacco companies for bringing this world to an end.

Do not forget that Sony used the mod scene to gain in the beginning.Yes it has great games but so did other consoles before the ps1 but they never managed to get the 70% of the world market(calculating ps1+2).The ps1 was the 1st console to get pirated(I donnot count the old amigas and ataris since they were from the flinstone's age and the games were not so spread around the world)If they really wanted to wipe out piracy they wouldn't have used the same(more or less) protection system in the PS2 and have created something like the Gamecube.Now that the Ps2 is established and to the end of its life they may try to make it unmodable.But the modders are also buisnesses.If they want to make their living let them be,why do you care?


P.S.1Facts:Some ps2 v12 do die unmodded reading dvd-+r(w) movies,NOT v9s though.There has been some kind or recal since even here the PS2 stock is limited before Christmass(WHY???)

P.S.2: -Pimpmastah for what you said about the customers.In my case I kept 5 consoles V12 for personal testing and stocked up in V10 and some V7s I found in a closing shop(sweet :) )If a customer wants to buy one for backups I let him know that the new one may burn so if he wants he can buy a v10 or risk it.They alway go the safe way.Until a fix is found and tested enough this is my policy

P.S3:For pic programmer in Europe check www.visoduck.com.I had been using them and they were reliable

P.S4:Sorry for the long post.I hope this is the last one offtopic in this thread

[XcalibEr]

:lol: :lol: :lol:
This is ridiculous, it really looks like you have no idea of what you are talking about.

By the way, did you read this thread of anarchy2007:
http://www.ps2newz.net/forums/showthread.php?t=29250

Is he also a liar just becouse he had 4 unmodded PS2 dead with burned LA and 6 unmodded PS2 with dead lasers in the last month?
Am I a liar just becouse I saw two PSTWO died unmodded?
Other respected members on this and other forum reported unmodded PS2/PSTWO deaths. Are we all liars?
But most important of all, who are you to tell us that we are all liars? :mad:

Grow up.

Chip&Chop

The question is WHY u prefere to accuese $osy for the dead ps2s and in the same way attack me on personal level just becose i say otherwise???

I read all the treads from the begining to the end, and i choose very cerfuly who to believe and who not!

about that a bad quality media are killing ps2 lens, i agree to that and it's also what i'm saying to my customers to use only high qality media such as Verbatim/tdk/pioneer. but it's not the cose on the consoles that died couple of seconds, minuts of even hours on install. so on the media issue we both agree!!!

I femilier with all the theories that goes around the scene, but as my father used to say: when 3 ppl tell u u'r a drank, go to sleep!!!

Magic team claims it's a chip problem loud and clear!

A very respectable person in this comunity and on others, about a year ago told me about what happens to version 9 and all about that the chip corrupt the eeprom data on initioation proces, but that was on a private chat and it was strange that no one brought it out to discussion. :crazy: and what a coinsidence , now the matrix and the ripper team trys to solve the mechcon lock problem :evilgrin:

the ripper and the matrix both claims the prblem is duo to system lock (ie mechcon locks) and thay wrote it black on white, what more u need to undrestand that the chips are killing the ps2s and for all that times they led us to believe that it's a shitty console problem.

You know what? u right, it could be part of sony blame if thay indeed put some "minds" in the ps2 inwhich it dies when installing a chip. in that case the chip companies need to redesign there chip from ground so that it will work without killing ps2s. and in case it's not possible i feel that i have the right to know the truth and deside if i want to install the chip or not.

All i wanted is to open u'r eyes to that even though we promessed to have a chip that is friendly to the console and it's from top qality (actel based an all that shit) thay sells us a chip that could (in some cases) kill u'r console cose it's a big money industry!!!

think of it a 2 ICs chip cost 3rd the price of a ps2 inwhice has tousent components and a dvd drive and the list goas on. the production of those chips is really ceap and the price is very high.

If a clone companies manage to sell the chips in 3.5 $ and still make a profit, the matrix team and others could sell it in 10$ and still make a big proffet!

The only thing is if u do sell u'r product and u sell it so expensive since it's top quality product, redesign it so it wont kill ps2s anymore.

this tread wouldn't start in the first place if the chip companies whare working on the problem since version 9 insted of running from it. :banghead:

Wake up and smell the flowers :p

[Dami0N]

I don't think its a question of how long the v12 is running with chip inside..
My v12 is running 2 weeks 24 hours a day.I guess once the game boots its okay..Its the reset and the powerup what kills those small machines.large voltage pieks.

the ripperteam just released there new version and vision about the syndrome.So my guess is that a little pic won't really solve the problem.

and yes XcalibEr they should have found a better solution for the v9/10 aswell because those where the 1st on which they created this little bug..

(might be wrong tho :) )

[anarchy2007]

$ony is obviously designing the new consoles to burn the coils when modifying it, this does not mean that because a console was modified that it will blow up or that all mod-chips damage consoles. I think proof of this is the fact that a simple 5v mod does not work on the new consoles, but on the otherhand I must honestly say that $ony must be getting back quite a few more damaged consoles that are unmodded. I know for a fact that I see a lot more dead lenses on v9 consoles than what I see on v5,6,7,8. The last consoles that gave this much problems where v3 & 4.

In this thread http://www.ps2newz.net/forums/showthread.php?t=29250 I am mearly trying to show the relation between dead consoles and some chips and non modded consoles, I did not post any of the dead consoles repaired by me that where modded in Dubai and Thailand, these I had quite a few of (maybe 5 or so) and all of them had mini-apple chips installed. Now Dubai and Thailand are very far from where I am, I think it's obvious that there can only be a handfull of these consoles in my country, makes you wonder? On the other hand you will need at least 1 out of every 10 consoles modified and 1 out of 100 for unmodded consoles to truely say that it is the chip, in my case the ratio has been 1% or less except for R1pper2. I also strongly feel that 70% of all problems are install relates and not modchip related. Let's be honost nobody is going to write on this forum "I did a very bad install of a Matrix Inf and now my console is stuffed" instead we get "I installed a Matrix Inf. and checked everything, I found no problems, but now my console is dead".

Now with all this said can we please stop arguing about the f*cking chips and rather focus on the fix for the problem. Excaliber your point is noted time to move on. If this isuue does not get resolved then what??? no more chips, no more installs, no more money????????

[sanjit]

Will this resistor do for the 12c508 fix?
http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/endecaSearch/partDetail.jsp?SKU=3060391&N=401

[kima]

Will this resistor do for the 12c508 fix?
http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/endecaSearch/partDetail.jsp?SKU=3060391&N=401

NO.. That resistor is 1,5 Ohm.. You have to find one 1500 Ohm = 1,5k Ohm

Kim A

[sanjit]

Thank's for the quick response I can't seem to find these resistor's anywhere in the uk,anybody have any ideas where to get them from?

[GlenC]

Farnel order code : 514068

http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/endecaSearch/partDetail.jsp?SKU=514068&N=401

Glen.

[Chip&Chop]

How many other resellers/installers are playing or trying differnet things as a fix, not enough. Come on, play a bit, you guys are making money, so what if you blow up 5 PSTWOS lasers trying things, its not like you are not going to be able to get your money back from doing v12 installs or selling v12 chips.

I Will test the New fix from summ0ne and the new one from Matrix in the next two PSTWO I have under test today.
Will mod them tomorrow.

I would like to do more tests, but there are very few PSTWO available around here, all shops are pratically out of stock....

Can you at least tell us if we need something special for your mod foundmy?
If yes I would like to stock it from now to be ready to test also your solution when you release it.

Chip&Chop.

[Chip&Chop]

The question is WHY u prefere to accuese $osy for the dead ps2s and in the same way attack me on personal level just becose i say otherwise???

I read all the treads from the begining to the end, and i choose very cerfuly who to believe and who not!
I am not attacking you on personal level becouse you think different of what I do.
I am attacking you becouse you cannot consider a liar everyone who thinks differently from you.

As you can have your opinion, I can have mine. No need to insult people telling them that they are liars.


this tread wouldn't start in the first place if the chip companies whare working on the problem since version 9 insted of running from it. :banghead:

Modchip company heve the same interest to solve this issue exactly like we modders do.
No more modding means no more work also for us.
So, instead of complaining and doing nothing, do help and make some tests on the PSTWO like we are doing.
There are 4 possible fixes to be tested out there. Take one and help with experimenting and testing.

Chip&Chop.

[psxgameshop]

Chip&Chop: The fix from summOne is workin fine for now.

psxgameshop

[TeknoZ]

the ripper and the matrix both claims the prblem is duo to system lock (ie mechcon locks) and thay wrote it black on white, what more u need to undrestand that the chips are killing the ps2s and for all that times they led us to believe that it's a shitty console problem.

Don't want to start a fight or attack you personally, but if this was the case why none of the V9/V10/V12 that I modded (several V9 at the beginning without Romeo mod) have ever had a problem?
True, I don't do hundreds of them but if it was a chip problem, some (if not most) of them should have failed by now.

It seems to me that many people fail to realize that electronics is a much more complicated science than it looks.
I design electronic equipment for living and I know that there are some basic precautions that you have to take when dealing with high speed signals.
Even routing differently some tracks can give any kind of strange behaviour.

I presonally believe that installation plays a much more important role in this problem than many people think.

[Ex-Cyber]

I'm a little loath to get involved in this, but the people who are eager to blame modchip makers seem to be missing an important point. Let's assume that the "mechacon lockup" theory is true (it seems to be the closest thing that exists to an accepted explanation, in any case). This rests on the core premise that a lockup of the mechacon causes the coils to be overdriven. Isn't this indicative of a poor design (not failing safely/gracefully) regardless of the reason that the mechacon locks up? Are we supposed to believe that Sony's engineers have such a perfect design that the mechacon cannot possibly lock up from a freak EMI burst or brownout? Of course I don't mean to say that the mod makers are 100% off the hook for this, but it seems pretty silly to say that they're the main guilty party when any fault on their part should really be resulting in the regular RSOD blues and not a burned laser. I also don't think this is some big anti-mod conspiracy by Sony; more likely it's a result of cost-cutting measures that cut just a little too deep. The problem itself is bad enough; no need to go around inventing more demons...

[XcalibEr]

I am not attacking you on personal level becouse you think different of what I do.
I am attacking you becouse you cannot consider a liar everyone who thinks differently from you.

As you can have your opinion, I can have mine. No need to insult people telling them that they are liars.




Modchip company heve the same interest to solve this issue exactly like we modders do.
No more modding means no more work also for us.
So, instead of complaining and doing nothing, do help and make some tests on the PSTWO like we are doing.
There are 4 possible fixes to be tested out there. Take one and help with experimenting and testing.

Chip&Chop.

Anyway i think that u'r wrong, but lets move to testing :)

I just recived (a moment ago) my first shippment of PsTwo :D man there buty :)

I'm running original games on it and will leave it like this for couple of hours.
I've also use old scrached games.

Next i'm about to try a swap with my action replay 2 (don't have magic disk sorry) and play backups (hopfully) :-pray:

After i'll see that there is no problem with the console i'll modify it using the 12c508 fix.

Now i'll go to find my old action replay :)
Did u try to install the infiity fix (12c508) without the diodes?

[XcalibEr]

Don't want to start a fight or attack you personally, but if this was the case why none of the V9/V10/V12 that I modded (several V9 at the beginning without Romeo mod) have ever had a problem?
True, I don't do hundreds of them but if it was a chip problem, some (if not most) of them should have failed by now.

It seems to me that many people fail to realize that electronics is a much more complicated science than it looks.
I design electronic equipment for living and I know that there are some basic precautions that you have to take when dealing with high speed signals.
Even routing differently some tracks can give any kind of strange behaviour.

I presonally believe that installation plays a much more important role in this problem than many people think.

Ok u right. me and couple of handred moders up-there, after modifing handreds of ps2s don't know to mod as good as u do!!!! :crazy:

[XcalibEr]

I don't think its a question of how long the v12 is running with chip inside..
My v12 is running 2 weeks 24 hours a day.I guess once the game boots its okay..Its the reset and the powerup what kills those small machines.large voltage pieks.

the ripperteam just released there new version and vision about the syndrome.So my guess is that a little pic won't really solve the problem.

and yes XcalibEr they should have found a better solution for the v9/10 aswell because those where the 1st on which they created this little bug..

(might be wrong tho :) )

What kink of fix did u apply to the consoel, if ever?

[Dami0N]

I did the heatsink fix....and the machine still works.....
Infinity inside with NO diodes.....

and you ??

[TeknoZ]

Ok u right. me and couple of handred moders up-there, after modifing handreds of ps2s don't know to mod as good as u do!!!! :crazy:

Yeah right, happy to see that you read and understood what I was trying to say. I just posted to show off my m4d m0dding skiilz! :rolleyes:

Still it doesn't explain why I have not had problems so far. Just luck? Or am I just talking BS?

Even if you don't like it, there are a lot of factors that needs to be taken in consideration in this problem. There is a guy in another forum who was describing how he could crash his pstwo by turning on some lights connected to the same powerplug as the pstwo power supply.
The ripper guys say that the machine can crash when the power plug is inserted, even with no modchip inside and in that case the coils will fry anyway.

This are all indications of a design fault to begin with. Add to that some stray capacitance because of solder flux not completely cleaned of a bad solder point and you certaibly have a design which is much more likely to fail.

[gums_work]

Is this PIC chip suitable for the fix?

http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/endecaSearch/partDetail.jsp?SKU=140223&N=401

[TeknoZ]

It can probably be used but why not get the 12c508 instead?

http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/endecaSearch/partDetail.jsp?SKU=140168&N=401

[Chip&Chop]

Anyway i think that u'r wrong, but lets move to testing :)

I just recived (a moment ago) my first shippment of PsTwo :D man there buty :)
Man, you did all of these disussions and you still didn't even open a PSTWO until now? :)
Ok, good luck with those babies now that you have them.
Test them hard before opening them. I got one blow up under test and one with erratic reading.


Did u try to install the infiity fix (12c508) without the diodes?
Like I wrote above I will test this fix tomorrow in one of the two PSTWO that are under test today.
I will do the 12c508 including also the diodes, as suggested on the matrix website.
The other PSTWO will have the summ0ne fix.


Chip&Chop

[Dami0N]

I see this threat is going the wrong way..instead of helping and discussing the problem your all trying to make a name for yourselfs..just let the ppl who make the mods find the best answers.Because there the ones that want to sell there freaking mods right!!

all we can do is report the broken stuff again after yet another v12 dead beef fix!!!

keep the faith .. hehe ;)

[GameOne]

somebody had tested the vandrunen fix?

[XcalibEr]

Man, you did all of these disussions and you still didn't even open a PSTWO until now? :)
Ok, good luck with those babies now that you have them.
Test them hard before opening them. I got one blow up under test and one with erratic reading.



Like I wrote above I will test this fix tomorrow in one of the two PSTWO that are under test today.
I will do the 12c508 including also the diodes, as suggested on the matrix website.
The other PSTWO will have the summ0ne fix.


Chip&Chop

THe discation was on the thchnical side, i didn't say i opend a PSTWO since it's just arive to my country!

First i wanna test it with backups without installing a chip.
I tested it with original and it works perfectly.

[XcalibEr]

Are there falty pstwo with cristal chip? or ***?

[Chip&Chop]

Are there falty pstwo with cristal chip? or ***?

Just to close the discussion on the unmodded PSTWO death, this was posted today on the board where with Romeo and other we are experimenting all the various PSTWO solutions:
http://www.consolenet.com/viewtopic.php?t=9124

Quick Translation:
"Between yesterday and today customers brought back to our shop FOUR UNMODDED pstwo that do not read anything more. I think $ony should take same strong actions... "

Translate by yourself with: babelfish.altavista.com

If you make a search there you find a ton of similar posts.

As for your question, yes, it was reported before death with ***, O2Chip and Cristal. It was all in the deleted thread.
And I still do not understand why they delated those threads, as they were full of informations and data on the first experiments on the V12.

Anyway, the only way to solve this issue is testing all the possible fixes that people are developing and help the research.


Chip&Chop.

[XcalibEr]

Just to close the discussion on the unmodded PSTWO death, this was posted today on the board where with Romeo and other we are experimenting all the various PSTWO solutions:
http://www.consolenet.com/viewtopic.php?t=9124

Quick Translation:
"Between yesterday and today customers brought back to our shop FOUR UNMODDED pstwo that do not read anything more. I think $ony should take same strong actions... "

Translate by yourself with: babelfish.altavista.com

If you make a search there you find a ton of similar posts.

As for your question, yes, it was reported before death with ***, O2Chip and Cristal. It was all in the deleted thread.
And I still do not understand why they delated those threads, as they were full of informations and data on the first experiments on the V12.

Anyway, the only way to solve this issue is testing all the possible fixes that people are developing and help the research.


Chip&Chop.

On the deleted threads one of my sujjestions was using current regulator.
And i found that a regulator fix is allready manufactured and it's on sell on a blue pcb.

thats really suppose to work , add it to the 12c508 fix and it sould be fine.

[Chip&Chop]

On the deleted threads one of my sujjestions was using current regulator.
And i found that a regulator fix is allready manufactured and it's on sell on a blue pcb.

thats really suppose to work , add it to the 12c508 fix and it sould be fine.

There are different solutions using voltage regulators.
Which one do you refer to?


Chip&Chop.

[yello]

one broken v12 with crystal chip here

[Thinkdiff]

http://www.mouser.com/index.cfm?&handler=data.listcategory&D=579-PIC12C508A04SM&terms=579-PIC12C508A04SM&Ntt=*579PIC12C508A04SM*&N=0&crc=true

That PIC good? My PIC Programmer kit just shipped. Anywhere that may have them cheaper in the US?

[Gradius]

one broken v12 with crystal chip here

Of course, because isn't the modchip (to blame) at all. This includes ANY modchip for PSTwo.

Gradius

[TeknoZ]

http://www.mouser.com/index.cfm?&handler=data.listcategory&D=579-PIC12C508A04SM&terms=579-PIC12C508A04SM&Ntt=*579PIC12C508A04SM*&N=0&crc=true

That PIC good? My PIC Programmer kit just shipped. Anywhere that may have them cheaper in the US?

That is the smd version. If you want the "normal" (DIL) one it's here :

http://www.mouser.com/index.cfm?handler=displayproduct&lstdispproductid=336768&e_categoryid=249&e_pcodeid=58061

[XcalibEr]

There are different solutions using voltage regulators.
Which one do you refer to?


Chip&Chop.

There is no info about the one i've seen, just a blue psb with regulator and other two components that sould be resistors but seem like capacitors.

There is two ways using current regulator, one to regulate the current into the LA chip and the other way is to regulate to the coils.

To do any of this fix there is a need to check how much the maximal currnt needed while using backups.

The matrix team says there chip (12c508) code get into acton 3 second after the mechcon hang up, isn't it a long time? what the max period of time between irq request that the dsp send to the mechcon and we can send it to couple miliseconds above the max value.

[villasg]

I found a new type of protection .
look (www.grmods.com/villasg/111.jpg)
installation (www.grmods.com/villasg/V12FIX-I.jpg)
The makers says Increase the life span of your lens on V12 PS2, prolong your V12 PS2 life. Especially console with modchip.

I think is a voltage regulator to aplly Vcc in track and focus ic.
I think a combination with this and matrix PIC fix is good.

[TeknoZ]

The matrix team says there chip (12c508) code get into acton 3 second after the mechcon hang up, isn't it a long time? what the max period of time between irq request that the dsp send to the mechcon
and we can send it to couple miliseconds above the max value.

By analyzing the code you can see that the three seconds is just an initial power up delay. Once the mechcon hang up the pic turns off the pstwo in 200ms which seems to be fast enough.

[TeknoZ]

II think is a voltage regulator to aplly Vcc in track and focus ic.
I think a combination with this and matrix PIC fix is good.

I wrote this in the old thread (the one now gone :( ).
It's an old test by Romeo to lower the supply voltage for the RS to around 6 volts.
I think that he later commented that even lowering the voltage to 6 volts was not enough to save the lens so this fix doesn't really help.

[plazma]

I think the best fix so far is Matrix pic fix combined with VanDrunen current limiter fix http://vandrunen.net/gallery/PSTwo_vanDrunen_Fix

I have installed few of these fixes and all work great. I hope there will be some pcb with smd components for the VanDuren fix.

[OttawaMods.com]

Would the PIC fix + diode fix work just as well?

[summ0ne]

Ok i dont mean to defend my fix cause its mine, but does anyone know how these other fixes work?

The vanduren and the one with the 5v stabilizer + 2 diodes do the same.
Since they cant reduce the voltage significantly - they dont. They reduce it by just 1V.

Thats nothing

[foundmy]

radish28, honestly, the diodes do some stuff,but the matrix PIC FIX is not a fix, but it does work, so if the bus is hung the unit does turn off...

summ0ne, still working on the dvdrw issue here? what are your coils (voltage and also ohms) at right now have the going up or down?

and can you play a dvdrw movie and let it run? let me know

any bus freezing?

[plazma]

VanDrunen fix does't reduce the voltage. It's a current limiter. It only steps in when thing go bad. It doesn't effect the reading ability of the PsTwo.

More about the fix at an other forum http://tinyurl.com/6ey5s

[makr0]

Ok I've got a slim PS2 unmodded, BUT I really want to get it modded. Since I'm waiting for an agreed fix until I do the mod I figure I may as well use my unmodded slim PS2 as a giunie Pig, to see if it really affects unmodded ps2. So I need instruction on how to reproduce it. I've got extended no questions ask warrenty, so I don't mind wrecking a few of them to help the cause.

[modordie]

green light is on [on the PIC programmer - kit 96] but i have no idea what to do with icprog after the hex is loaded...?


PLEASE POST GENERAL INSTRUCTIONS FOR PREP AND FLASHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!


im getting a prvilaged instruction error when i boot icprog, but it still loads fine. then when i attempt to program the device it gives a windows debug error and then freezes.... any help is GREATLY APPRECIATED :)

[loggy49]

I don't know if this was already considered, but what about replacing the PS11-fuse
with a self-resetting SMD-fuse blowing at current over 0.5A ?
This could be a cheap(~1$, Polyswitch MiniSMD) and easy installation.
No more PIC or current limiter.

[ian-cabby]

modordie: Download the 2000/XP drivers. Save them in the same directory as ICProg.

Run ICProg, go into settings and select use 2000/XP driver, it will restart and everything will be fine.

Ian.

[plazma]

I don't know if this was already considered, but what about replacing the PS11-fuse
with a self-resetting SMD-fuse blowing at current over 0.5A ?
This could be a cheap(~1$, Polyswitch MiniSMD) and easy installation.
No more PIC or current limiter.

This could work and would be easy to solder. You could use only the Polyswitch fuse or combined with Matrix pic fix. I guess the PsTwo would just hang if you use only the Polyswitch fuse.

[modordie]

IAN:

when i try to verify the HEX Code it errors this:

"Verify Failed at address 0000h !"


does this mean anything and if so, what?


ALSO, when i attempt to flash with icprog it reads the HEX and then gives me this yes/no message:

No "Oscillator Calibration Found" found.
Do you want to use value from (0FFFh) instead?


What should i do?


tnx,


noocllez

[XcalibEr]

I used my pstwo with magic swap 2 and it works perfectly.

[TomasAlmgren]

Anyone have anything to say about the ripper 3 teams analysis of the situation. Is it just a marketing ploy or does the modchips actually increase the chance of having ure PSTwo killed.
http://www.ripper3.com/v12_DEAD_BEEF_095.pdf

[foundmy]

the Ripper3 info is true regarding what happens and coils burning etc. but to say their chip does stuff better, that might be a marketing issue.

[T07N]

I didn't read all that stuff, I wouldn't understand it anyways. But I skimmed through it, they suggested that the modchips were the problem with the pstwo? Why are non-modded pstwo burning out as well?

We must remember this is the team that took Matrix Team's code and use it on their Ripper 3, then claim that other chips are troublesome.

[ian-cabby]

Modordie: Your getting a "Verify failed as address 0000h" because you must have the CP (code protection) fuse enabled, do not set this fuse and you will be able to verify it afterwards..

If you test the chip to see if its been programmed - which it most likely has, do a Blank Check on the chip, if it says its blank, it hasn't programmed, if it says not blank, it has.. You can test to see if the chips working by connecting pin 4 to GND instead of point K. The pstwo should turn on when pressing reset and turn itself off after three seconds.

As for the No Oscillator Calibration found", I don't think its anything to worry about, i've had this in the past, ignored it and chip still worked fine.

Ian.

[TeknoZ]

Modordie : If you get the no oscillator calibration message and you also have the verify error that most probably means that your programmer is not functioning properly or that the pic is not inserted in the programming socket.

Both errors are related to the programmer not being able to read the pic, so you should check your hardware settings in icprog and install the required drivers if your OS needs them.

[summ0ne]

VanDrunen fix does't reduce the voltage. It's a current limiter. It only steps in when thing go bad. It doesn't effect the reading ability of the PsTwo.

More about the fix at an other forum http://tinyurl.com/6ey5s

Ok, i rectract my statement - read more about the fix - it is a very good one and does the job. Great job!

[modordie]

could it be that the power supply is insufficient?

im currently using an old laptop PSU, which has no lables on it to inform me of which VDC is being distributed...

and DAMN, i've been all over this city and i cant find one store that has a +16VDC Power Adapter :mad:

if anyone knows of any chain stores that are common in the states [and sell Power Adapters of that type] i would really like to know...


tnx,


MODorDie

[plazma]

I just installed a V12. I got only black screen and no red light on reset button.
I fixed it with replacing the the 1.5kOhm resistor with a 2kOhm on the Matrix Pic Fix.

Now my happy customer got a V12+***4 Lite with double protection (Matrix pic fix and vanDrunen current limiter) :D

Just mentioning this if someone else got a similar problem. Team Matrix mentioned about this in their pic fix document.

[modordie]

ok,

i found 2 power adapters at a local store but niether of them fit exactly in the parameters for this PIC programmer:

the programmer says to use:

17-30VDC
or
13-20VAC

and the 2 power adapters i found are:

13-28VDC
and
18-24VAC


my question is which should i go with [if any...]?

ALSO: i have this PIC programmer [http://store.qkits.com/moreinfo.cfm/QK96] and im wondering what Hardware Settings i should set in ICProg? [i see JDM, i dont see my specific programmer and im not sure if i should select any other for this K96 Kit]...


tnx,

noocllez...

[TomasAlmgren]

Tony its all explained in the link posted above. The modchips doesnt cause the problem but they increas the risk. So bad chipdesign clearly increases the risk of having ure console damaged. I think this is a big progress thou since this is the first time ever ive heard a modchip team saying their product might have something to to with v9/v10/v12 deaths. I have suspected this a long time, but now its official so to say.

[modordie]

k, now im at least getting something...

when i try to flash or verify the device with PICall:

"Program error:

Program: address=0000 buffer=0025 device=0FFF"


any ideas?

[I CAN read and blankcheck the 12C508 though... im thinking it may have to be the PSU im using, because ive connected it directly to the parallel port..]


tnx,


noocllez

[Albert35]

Help needed with the following.
I need some who understand the code that is below and who knows how to make a few changes to it or who can translate this to the langues C so that I can make the changes myself..
It is the code from Matrix PIC12C508 fix I want to make the pic monitor an other signal as well but don't understand a thing of assambler code??
WHo can help on this ?? Contact me in private message


org

movwf OSCCAL ;0025
movlw 192 ;B'11000000' ;0CC0
option ; GPWU GPPU /TOCS /TOSE Timer0 ͕ ;0002
movlw 255 ;B'11111111' ;0CFF
tris GPIO ; in : 543210, out : ;0006
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
call 99 ;0963
0045 clrwdt ;0004
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
movlw 200 ;B'11001000' ;0CC8
movwf 18 ;0032
0068 movlw 1 ;B'00000001' ;0C01
call 99 ;0963
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
decfsz 18,F ;02F2
goto 68 ;0A44
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
btfsc GPIO,GP3 ;B'00000011' ;0666
goto 45 ;0A2D
movlw 251 ;B'11111011' ;0CFB
movwf GPIO ;0026
tris GPIO ;0006
0097 clrwdt ;0004
goto 97 ;0A61

; Sous-routine
0099 movwf 16 ;0030
0100 movlw 250 ;B'11111010' ;0CFA
movwf 17 ;0031
0102 clrwdt ;0004
decfsz 17,F ;02F1
goto 102 ;0A66
decfsz 16,F ;02F0
goto 100 ;0A64
retlw 0 ;B'00000000' ;0800

[GTZ]

Has anyone come across any PSTwo's that are fried with a Ripper chip installed?? I ask because I've been following this discussion from the beginning of the first thread (this being #3) and I don't recall seeing a report on fried coils/laser on a unit chipped with a Ripper. Correct me if I'm wrong.
I also ask because vanDrunen states that Matrix and others insert dirty code while patching and the Ripper, DeeEmEss4 do not.

http://web02063.prolocation.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3371&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=75
Quote: '(1) The Matrix PIC fix is only able to reset/turn off the PS2 when the Mechacon locks DURING operation.

These lock-ups during play are usually caused by chips that patch the DVD controller in a bad way... like the Matr1x 1nfinity (that's why they made their PIC fix, so they can still sell their bad chips) and the Ripper and ***4 chips don't have this problem! ' End Quote.

Cheers,
GTZ

[Chip&Chop]

You won't find any report of dead PSTWO with Ripper3, becouse the Ripper3 is not PSTWO compatible until now.....:rolleyes:

It looks like until now they have not been able to rip the latest Matrix or ***4 firmware for the V12 :p
So much for their advanced coding knowledge.

It is out of my understanding how can people still belive to what they say.


Chip&Chop.

[AT6767]

Ok for the PIC FIX aka matrix v2 fix how do i install the resistor? does it matter which way it goes? Also where can i get a real cheap PIC Programmer
or how can i make one. If i do the diode fix, the PIC fix, and the van druen fix will this prevent my ps2 from dieing and making last for years to come? Are there any side effects to these fixes. I heard u had to get up and unplug it to turn it off.

[TomasAlmgren]

ripper 3.1 will be v12 compatible and iknow im getting them like next week

[TomasAlmgren]

if u installed a ripper 3 in a v12 it wont work since that chip doesnt support v12 lol

[modordie]

ripper==fag_balls;

[loy]

please keep thread on topic

[Unununium]

I have been testing my unmodded console for a while now. I hear that after so many resets sooner or later the laser coils get burnt out so I have been putting my pstwo through reset tests. Yesterday I reset my console let it boot a disc then reset and do it again. I did this about 50 times and each time the same thing always happens...it would boot. Are pstwos locking up during operation while your playing or is it during the boot on session? If my pstwo is going to mess up I want it to happen before my warranty runs out so I can get another. After yesterday I'm fairly confident that my pstwo is not going to burn it's coils out after so many resets or so much play time; i let it run for 48 hours once. Has anyone been able to trigger it over and over?

[aqua]

a strange thing - since the matrix diode fix, matrix pic fix and current limiter fix, no one has posted experiencing a burned out laser. Up till a few days before any fixes were out ppl were saying psrwo consoles are burning out after only a cpl hrs or minutes playing.

Installers what % of burned consoles without any fix compared to consoles with either 1 fix, 2 fixes or maybe 3 fixes.

Could the problems with lasers on v12 without fixes be due a faulty batch?? not enough info here, rather a lot of guess work!!!

[makr0]

Unununium I've abusing my unmodded PSTwo now for about 2 days, resetting it over and over, running it for long periods of time. I reset it every couple of minutes for about 2 hours while I watched tv and had no ill effects. I've also been doing things like pulling the powercord mid load, opening the tray randomly, but it's still fine.

And on with what aqua is say, has anyone look into the possiblity of a faulty batch of units?

[tickford]

Could the problems with lasers on v12 without fixes be due a faulty batch?? not enough info here, rather a lot of guess work!!!

I think its the mods that are killing the pstwo's.I just had one done with the diode fix & ***4,put in original ps2 game,turned it on,& it blew the laser.Now this can't be such a coincidence for so many people(after modded). :(

[Chip&Chop]

I have been thinking from a lot of time that the blown PSTWO could have been all coming from some specific factory.
There has been less reports of burned PSTWO in respect of the first days, but it is yet to understand if it is becouse there are less PSTWO available in the market in these days or becouse the last batches are coming from an healty factory.

I guess we will all have to wait to discover this when $ony will start again to deliver PSTWO in large quantities, and not few pieces for shipment like they are doing now.
We are actually unable to get them in quantities in this period :(

tickford, everyone, PLEASE stop this issue of the modchips burning the PSTWO.
I am modding the PSTWO after testing them in a good way before opening them, and until now not one came back.

Chip&Chop

[TeknoZ]

I think its the mods that are killing the pstwo's.I just had one done with the diode fix & ***4,put in original ps2 game,turned it on,& it blew the laser.Now this can't be such a coincidence for so many people(after modded). :(

Did you install the 12c508? I have been reading some good reports about the pic fix lately on some italian forums.

[AT6767]

Ok for the PIC FIX aka matrix v2 fix how do i install the resistor? does it matter which way it goes? Also where can i get a real cheap PIC Programmer
or how can i make one. If i do the diode fix, the PIC fix, and the van druen fix will this prevent my ps2 from dieing and making last for years to come? Are there any side effects to these fixes. I heard u had to get up and unplug it to turn it off.

[aqua]

CHIP&CHOP - are you applying any fixes to the pstwo's??

how many have you done without 1 returned back. I do pal 70004 consoles here with ***4 lite, don't have any probs here, but my machines only started rolling out last week, all have pic fix though, but i would prefer if i were sure not to install the pic fix!!!
mb version 041 here!!

[Chip&Chop]

Aqua,
Like I wrote before, I do 24H test and multiple reset test on each PSTWO i receive before opening it.
Any problem I give it back to customer and refuse to open it.

Done some with the diodes only, one with the diode+pic and one with summ0ne fix.
The last two will be delivered to customers tomorrow.
For now, no came back.


AT6767,
no one can give you any insurance that your PSTWO with one, more or all the fixes available now will be protected for years to come.
Only after some monthes we will know if there are or there aren't more problems with these machines.
If you need a guarantee than don't open your PSTWO.


Chip&Chop.

[tickford]

tickford, everyone, PLEASE stop this issue of the modchips burning the PSTWO.

So you think the modchip has no effect on the pstwo blowing the lasers??
I tested this machine thoroughly(as u do),then the 1st time I apply power after mod,it pops. :mad:
That would be a hell of a coincidence,don't u reckon??
I agree that the pstwo is probably has a crap design,& they blow lasers un-modded too,but they are more susceptible with a mod in.....so hopefully one of these fixes will overcome the problem(s). :-pray:

[kornkid]

This may seem a little far fetched, but does anyone remember when all of this madness with cheap/faulty parts started in ps2s? Yes, thats right! In the V9!! Now, what major change happened between V7/V8 and the V9.... hmm... could it be the fact the $ony moved from their factory in Japan to China??? If I recall correctly, the PS2s were shit when the Chinese factory started pumping them out... Maybe this is why the V12 sucks... Just a thought... What does everyone else think?

[swordfish]

kornkid: I agree with you 100%. I've modded hundreds (literally) of PS2s, and have noticed the quality go downhill since they have been manufactured in China. Some may disagree by saying that systems made in Japan were worse, but then again this applies to the earlier versions. I believe the V7 Japanese-made systems to be one of the stronger models out there. Now if we had V9-V12 systems still being made in Japan, I'm sure quality would be better (not to mention if better parts were used).

I also noticed that Chinese systems made at the "Foxconn" factory were better than the "Shenzhen" ones.

Just my 2 cents.

swordfish

[swordfish]

As for the V12 laser issue, out of 20+ systems I've modded and performed the diode fix only, I've had 1 system die (have yet to confirm this as it still may be ok). Not too bad a ratio if you ask me.

Will be experimenting with the PIC fix soon.

swordfish

[T07N]

kornkid: I agree with you 100%. I've modded hundreds (literally) of PS2s, and have noticed the quality go downhill since they have been manufactured in China. Some may disagree by saying that systems made in Japan were worse, but then again this applies to the earlier versions. I believe the V7 Japanese-made systems to be one of the stronger models out there. Now if we had V9-V12 systems still being made in Japan, I'm sure quality would be better (not to mention if better parts were used).

I also noticed that Chinese systems made at the "Foxconn" factory were better than the "Shenzhen" ones.

Just my 2 cents.

swordfish

Does Sony buy parts from someone then assemble or the factoies make the parts and assemble?

[XcalibEr]

So you think the modchip has no effect on the pstwo blowing the lasers??
I tested this machine thoroughly(as u do),then the 1st time I apply power after mod,it pops. :mad:
That would be a hell of a coincidence,don't u reckon??
I agree that the pstwo is probably has a crap design,& they blow lasers un-modded too,but they are more susceptible with a mod in.....so hopefully one of these fixes will overcome the problem(s). :-pray:

I'm so agree with u!!!!

Maby the Ripper is not the best chip in the market, and maby thay use to rip from others to build it, but even ripping need electronic knolage, and u can tell it by reading there docs about the v12 simptoms.

if u read it, combine with the reson the matrix team released the 12c508 (mechcon lockup which not accuring on non modified ps2s) and the statement of magic team, and u got the reall reson for blowing ps2.

Guys we r not the once who need to sucrify are ps2s on order to find fix for it, to modchip companies need sice thare making alot of money from it!!!

and from what i'm seeing thay need to implement the "fix" into the chip, or redesign the chip to be more friendly with the PsTwo.

the chips main feture it to run backups, but it's not the only one, it also need to work on the ps2 without kill hem or without trigger a "bug" in it to make it be dead. that's what i call PsTwo comptible chip!!!

[XcalibEr]

This may seem a little far fetched, but does anyone remember when all of this madness with cheap/faulty parts started in ps2s? Yes, thats right! In the V9!! Now, what major change happened between V7/V8 and the V9.... hmm... could it be the fact the $ony moved from their factory in Japan to China??? If I recall correctly, the PS2s were shit when the Chinese factory started pumping them out... Maybe this is why the V12 sucks... Just a thought... What does everyone else think?

Most of the electronic eqipment is build in china and taiwan, and even the most quality products are produced there.

The factory is not who design the schematics and it's not the one who decide which chips to use , it's only does the job of building it and under the supervision of $ony, so this theroy is not correct.

It's common things this days that u'll find "made in china.." on good reputation branded products from companies all over the world, it's just to reduce production costs.

[Albert35]

The vanDuren Fix is not working... It is a current limiter and is verry simple
to understand when the current is over 500mA it will regulate the current back
to 500mA by lowering the output voltage.. So what will happen verry simple.

Whe asume the vanDuren fix is coming in action and current to the RS2004FS will
be steady at 500mA In the worst case spindel motor stoped running an there
flows 500mA to both coils then these coils have to consume 500mA / 2 = 250mA
each this is 250mA² X 5 oHm = 0.31 watt so the total power that is consumed by
the coils is 0.62 watt this is to mutch for the coils they will burn..

You can test it in a easy way: Take an old laser from a V3 or V4 (hks-400b) and
connect the both coils parralel. Then connect the coils to a regulated power-
supply and adjust it so the current to both coils is 500mA and wait for a litle
while you will see youre coils burning out.. And when they start melting the
current wil go up becourse the resistanse of the coils decrease if you will have
fun dowing this for a longer time you have to regulate youre power supply so that
the current will be steady at 500mA. This is what the vanDuren fix is doing also.

Afther testing the above you must keep in mind that the coils in the new PStwo
are mutch smaller then the onse in a hks-400b lens so they can consume less power.

There is an other reason the vanDuren fix isn't working.
When a normal PStwo user is using his PStwo and it hangs his screen will freese
(or not) and he wil not know what is wrong so at this point the vanDuren fix is
doing its work but the user is still waiting for his screen to respond again
(or is still playing).. It can take a verry long time before the user gets the
idea there is somthing wrong and responds by resetting his PStwo or disconnect
the power cord. At that point damage to the laser is already done.

Last words abouth the vanDuren fix:
At the moment this fix limits the current to the RS2004FS, supply voltage to the
RS2004FS will drop and this chip will gonna behave verry strange with all kind of
dammage to the PStwo (sled and spindle motors)
As in the text I found on a other forum you can read the following:
When you look at my install pictures you see that I unsoldered a fuse first.
When you solder two wires to the two points where the fuse used to be and hook a
current meter up in between, you'll measure currents between 10 and 600 mA with
normal operation. When the Mechacon has crashed and the coils are driven at full
current the current to the RS2004FS can go up to 2 Amps, it's just not enough to
make the fuse PS11 blow. About 200 mA would go to the spindle motor and the power
electronics (I don't have exact measurements, I didn't have a scope for this) and
the rest would go through one or both coils.


He is measureing the current with a normal current meter. You have to know there is
not a steady current flowing so it is imposible to measure it with a normal current
meter and i presume he used a digital one that is mutch to slow for this kind of
measurements.
He olso wrote the folowing
(I don't have exact measurements, I didn't have a scope for this)

He has no scope so what is he doing ??? He can't know how any of the signals look
like or behave.. He is just sucking all this crap out off his who knows what !!
But he also noted the folowing:
When you would limit the current at less than 300 mA you would see a lot
strange responses from the sled and spindle motors, especially during spin-up and
disc seek. 400 mA works fine, but gave me some strange noises from the sled motor
on a rare occasion... so I kept it at 500 mA... no real "scientifically proven"
value, but ok, feel free to experiment.

He is just doing an expiriment but oke he saw what happend (I was telling about
it before) when his fix is in action an limits the current below 300mA. Or better
when his fix droped supply voltage of the RS2004FS below 6volt there are a lot of
strange responses from the sled and spindle motors. THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT WILL
HAPPEN DURING A HANGUP OF THE MECHACON AND WILL DAMAGE YOURE PStwo But no worry he
investigated a litle longer:
When the Mechacon crashes and the current is limited at 500 mA I could
measure 180 up to 240 mA through the coils when the spindle motor is off, 180 mA
is about the same as maximum during normal operation and 240 is the peak during
normal operation. With the spindle motor still on at high speeds these currents
are lower.

He tells us that 240mA current to each coil is maximum.. WELL HE WAS ONLY THINKING
THIS !!! If he had a scope he would know that the max current to each coil can be
1.6A during a few μS (micro seconds) But whe have a good vanDuren fix it is only
way to slow to detect and respond to this current.. When it was fast enough the
PStwo wouldn't read any disk.

That's enough abouth the vanDuren fix what is a total waist of time

[drewid]

interesting to see you trashed his attempt.. i would love to see your fix..

[T07N]

interesting to see you trashed his attempt.. i would love to see your fix..

He's just explaining the cons of the method. No where does he say that he can do better. Just informing people of the cons.

[aqua]

Albert35, thanks for your info, I hope you are right, as I am not so technical myself, but it does save time and money for installers who were to apply this fix!!!

Does the pic fix on its own solve all the problems??

[Albert35]

I'm sure PIC fix is a good fix for now.. But in my opinion there must be some minor changes to it to make it worck perfect..
At the moment I'm working on a fix that is not solving the problems becourse there is now way to prevent MECHACON an DSP to hang other than a complete redesign of the PStwo..

As I asked befor I need some who can make some changes to the code of the PIC solution.
I need someone hwo can make it monitor on pin 6 an other signal. I can't program in Assambler so someone has to help me a bit with it.. If this is completed I will release the fix that is in my opinion a perfect way to prevent youre PStwo from burning it's coils complete with an explanation of the way it works..

So If anyone has (hopfully today) the time to make a litle change to the MAtrix PIC code send me an private message I will send the information on how the pic has to work in my opinion. and afther programming I can release all info I have in a day.

[DickesB]

@Albert

I think you don't know what you are talking about! The PIC realizes in 3sec that something is wrong. For this 3 sec goes nearly 2A as you mentioned through the coils and laser. With vanDrunen Fix that would be only 0,5A tell me whats better, ha?! :crazy: If you had read all of his posts you would know, that he has a scope in university for using. Kombinationen of PIC-Fix and vanDrunen ist best solution today!

[modordie]

PLEASE HELP :-pray:

I thought i finally figured this PIC programmer out, i selected the TAIT Programmer in HW settings and it started flashing [taking the normal 5-10min to flash] and showing slower programming times. then it finished, does the programming configuration and verifies. But when the verification progress bar completes i get:

FAILED VERIFICATION

and i when i read from the apparently flashed 12c508, i get all "0FFF"...


WHY IS THIS HAPPENING???

The red lights were going on and off like they would if it was programming properly and yet i still get crap when i verify or try to read... :mad:


ANY HELP IS MUCH APPRECIATED :cool:

noocllez...

[villasg]

You have marked the CP as ON


Like this

[modordie]

no, no i didnt. no code protect.

and, i also made sure to NOT use the Oscillator Callibration Value from the file (0FFFh). clicked NO and let it get that from the chip...


ANY OTHER IDEAS? ;)


noocllez

[vanDrunen]

Hey... it's me.. vanDrunen

okay... all you (Albert35) said has a base of truth. BUT.... you assume too much!

* The current limiter limits the current for the whole chip and not only the coils (bummer... why isn't there an entirely different power supply for the coil actuator.. and no it's not pin 32 only) so you have to keep the maximum current quite high in order to keep your system performing normally. But luckily when the Mechacon has crashed and the spindle motor and the sled not moving NOT the full maximum current will go through your coils. A quite large part of the power will be dissipated in your RS2004FS due to the opamps internal resistance. Your coils will hold out MUCH longer compared to a non-limited current going through. I used current probes on a scope at the university to monitor coil currents during operation and during a mechacon crash, I only used the multimeter at home for monitoring during longer term tests. My multimeter shows the actual current (but is slow) and the max. and min. current over past 1, 3 or 5 seconds (very acurately). Actually... I usually use my "fused" multimeter in the current measurement mode as a "fuse replacement" during tests ;-)

* The current limiter operates quite slowly! So little peak currents can still go up to 2 Amps for coil regulation, no problem. The LM317 is a DC current regulator, not some high frequency type with a good transient response, which is good in this case. Even when your system would consume a lot of power and the current limiter would lower voltage below 6 volts, this would not be a problem. The RS2004FS is an analog device and not a digital one that needs to be properly reinitialised. Power is distributed over the motors and the coils and it's opamps by the RS2004FS, when a "brown out" occurs your motors will move a bit slower and the whole issue will resolve itsself.

* When I was testing my many different current limiters at the university I found that this simple one performs "good enough". During a Mechacon crash your coils will at least hold out those 3 seconds your PIC needs to turn off the console. Even if the PIC would fail to turn it off you "at least" have some spare time to walk to the PSTwo and pull out the plug.

* I would like to hear a very good explanation too about why lowering the voltage under 6 volts and the "strange behaviour" that would result would EVER damage the console or the motors ;-). This strange behaviour is what happens on a brown out. When the sled motor is accellerated for instance to move to a certain position and in the same time the spindle motor would turn on and the maximum current would not be sufficient to power both motors, then one or both of the motors would go slower all of a sudden. You can hear this accellerating and slowing down of the motors and the disc wouldn't read on normal speeds, those are "strange responses" in my opinion, but would never ever do any damage, they would just suck.

* I also built a set of 2x 1:1 current limited opamps with a good transient response that could be placed directly in between the coils and the Actuator. This set of opamps worked wonderfully, but they never got to limit the current after applying the fix with the LM317. The direct coil current limiters were also too complicated and would also limit those very short peak currents... and that really does degenerate performace. So I only kept the LM317 and took out the rest and tested it.. and hoped for the best and it works, at least "good enough".

* I don't mind criticism on any of my little designs, including this simple one. People should be critical and not just copy everything other people say/make. Like I said, there is a base of truth in these critics, but it's one thing to "Reason" about all the cons and think in "worst case" scenarios's... and it's another to just buy some PSTwo's and actually sit down and test the whole thing and come up with improvements. I bought 8 and blew up 3, 1 is sold and the other 4 are under test.... with a current limiter AND a 12F509 PIC with some watchdog code I wrote.

[modordie]

ALSO,

now when i select VERIFY DURING PROGRAMMING option, i get:

"Programming failed at code address 0000h !"


ANY IDEAS? :crazy:

is there any other place in ICProg that "CP" could be enabled???


noocllez
http://MODorDie.com

[TeknoZ]

The PIC realizes in 3sec that something is wrong. For this 3 sec goes nearly 2A as you mentioned through the coils and laser.

The pic intervention time is not 3 seconds but 200ms. You can check that by disassembling the .hex file.

[Chip&Chop]

So you think the modchip has no effect on the pstwo blowing the lasers??
I tested this machine thoroughly(as u do),then the 1st time I apply power after mod,it pops. :mad:
That would be a hell of a coincidence,don't u reckon??
I agree that the pstwo is probably has a crap design,& they blow lasers un-modded too,but they are more susceptible with a mod in.....so hopefully one of these fixes will overcome the problem(s). :-pray:

Sorry to say this, but if you make a search on his board you will find people that last year were saying exactly the same words when the V9/V10 problem came out:
"I tested it 1 week and as soon as modded it blowed!!! Damn modchips, they are all making V9 blow up!!! They need to redesign their modchips!!!"
Than there was the commercial people coming into the forum telling "Hey, my modchip will not make the LA blow, becouse of bla bla bla bla..."

We all know how the "V9 LA chip" story ended....:rolleyes:

This is just the same story repeating with a different issue in a different PS2 model.


Chip&Chop.

[summ0ne]

Nice work, Albert35 - doing it to every last detail :-)

[swordfish]

Hmm, while browsing the net I stumled on this little PCB. It's supposed to "prevent the coils from burning". This was the only response I got.. :rolleyes:

Judging from the pic, can anyone confirm it's the real deal?

swordfish

[summ0ne]

Hmm, while browsing the net I stumled on this little PCB. It's supposed to "prevent the coils from burning". This was the only response I got.. :rolleyes:

Judging from the pic, can anyone confirm it's the real deal?

swordfish

This is the lamest fix. it lowers the voltage from 8.5 to 5+0.7+0.7=6.4 doing absolutely NOTHING

[modordie]

summOne:

your doing so well with this and sound like you know alot...

any chance i could get a little help on my previous posts?

[Chip&Chop]

Maby the Ripper is not the best chip in the market, and maby thay use to rip from others to build it, but even ripping need electronic knolage, and u can tell it by reading there docs about the v12 simptoms.

If they really had the knowledge why rip other people work?? :rolleyes:



(mechcon lockup which not accuring on non modified ps2s) and the statement of magic team, and u got the reall reson for blowing ps2.
Again? wasn't enough the link i passed to you? or you simply didn't even bother to go to check it?
Tell me please, WHAT PROVES you have to support your statement?
What experiments did you do? what test you made?



the chips main feture it to run backups, but it's not the only one, it also need to work on the ps2 without kill hem or without trigger a "bug" in it to make it be dead. that's what i call PsTwo comptible chip!!!
You talk like if you modded hundred of PSTWO and saw most of them die after modding, but you actually stated in a previous post that you received your first PSTWO only three days ago...
I suggest you start modding them and get some real experience with them before talking about issues you didn't even face until now.
At least I saw with my eyes some PSTWO die, and I can talk about it

By the way, no one of the almost 20 I modded until now died.
Strange, uh?


Chip&Chop

[Chip&Chop]

Hmm, while browsing the net I stumled on this little PCB. It's supposed to "prevent the coils from burning". This was the only response I got.. :rolleyes:

This fix was already tested by some modders in another board and found not working.


Chip&Chop

[XcalibEr]

If they really had the knowledge why rip other people work?? :rolleyes:




Again? wasn't enough the link i passed to you? or you simply didn't even bother to go to check it?
Tell me please, WHAT PROVES you have to support your statement?
What experiments did you do? what test you made?




You talk like if you modded hundred of PSTWO and saw most of them die after modding, but you actually stated in a previous post that you received your first PSTWO only three days ago...
I suggest you start modding them and get some real experience with them before talking about issues you didn't even face until now.
At least I saw with my eyes some PSTWO die, and I can talk about it

By the way, no one of the almost 20 I modded until now died.
Strange, uh?


Chip&Chop

I sayed i got my first PsTwo not Ps2 , there is a diffrent u know !!!

I modified alot of ps2s but didn't modified a pstwo, is that making me lesser installer???

And no, i don't think i should sucrefiese my pstwo for the modchip industry. there the ones who made furtune of selling them!!!

We pay them alot for there products, let them earn the money and find a solution for the problem.

Sorry, but i'm playing with the pstwo i have in here backups using swap magic and it's working fine for couple of days now. No mechcon hangups working just great.

the same thing with a customr of mine, playing with a swap magic and same thing - no problems at all.

If thay'll die then i'll post it and even appolegize , but for now , from what i see, i don't buy this theory of self destructive consoles.

[summ0ne]

summOne:

your doing so well with this and sound like you know alot...

any chance i could get a little help on my previous posts?

well i use IC prog alot with two different programmers.
I have win2003 and use the icprog.sys XP/NT/2k driver. when u check that box to enable the sriver it wants to restart icprog, click yes and have the sys file in the dir.

Here are the only settings u must change to get it to work.
-fresh start, dont verify during programming.
-look at the jpgs ;-)

[summ0ne]

my ICprog always displays the error in 1.jpg - it does work nevertheless

[modordie]

do i still have to check "Enable VCC control for JDM" if im not using a JDM [im using a TAIT]?

thanks,


noocllez

[summ0ne]

then prolly not :-)

[villasg]

Hmm, while browsing the net I stumled on this little PCB. It's supposed to "prevent the coils from burning". This was the only response I got.. :rolleyes:

Judging from the pic, can anyone confirm it's the real deal?

swordfish

I have this items .
http://www.grmods.com/villasg/Page1_8.htm
I propose a combination of Matrix pic fix and this small item ( current regulator )

:shhh:

[villasg]

no, no i didnt. no code protect.

and, i also made sure to NOT use the Oscillator Callibration Value from the file (0FFFh). clicked NO and let it get that from the chip...


ANY OTHER IDEAS? ;)


noocllez

Maybe your pic12c508 is NOT blank but is proggramed with CP
:banghead:

[modordie]

when i do a blank check, it says the chip is blank. but, i dont know because i know the chip has it's own oscillator calibration stuff...

i really dont know...

but, plz post any ideas you may have for me to test ;)


tnx,


noocllez
MODorDie

[modordie]

IS IT POSSIBLE TO JUST INSTALL THE 12C508 PIC FIX [FOR TESTING PURPOSES] WITHOUT INSTALLING THE MATRIX INFINITY OR ANY OTHER FIXES?

tnx,

noocllez

[OttawaMods.com]

in this post someone said to test it put pin 4 to ground instead of k and the pstwo should reset many times..

EDIT: Spelling :D im horrible for typos.

[modordie]

i know, but can you JUST install the 12c508 fix to test it?

or do you have to install the MI for that to function properly?


tnx,


noocllez

[OttawaMods.com]

yes the 12c508 fix is independant of the diode/vandunren fix.

[modordie]

k, ill test that bitch out indi then...

[wmb88]

@Albert

I think you don't know what you are talking about! The PIC realizes in 3sec that something is wrong. For this 3 sec goes nearly 2A as you mentioned through the coils and laser. With vanDrunen Fix that would be only 0,5A tell me whats better, ha?! :crazy: If you had read all of his posts you would know, that he has a scope in university for using. Kombinationen of PIC-Fix and vanDrunen ist best solution today!

Albert may know a lot more than vanDrunen by reading posts of both of them in my view. If a DC current ranged from 0.5A to 2A applied to the coils, they will burn out anyway regardless which fix is used. Please just give idea and suggestion, stop blaming.

[TeknoZ]

when i do a blank check, it says the chip is blank. but, i dont know because i know the chip has it's own oscillator calibration stuff...

I already told you that in a past thread but you probably missed it :)
If you get the error about missing the oscillator calibration value it means that the programmer is not reading the chip.
You should stop trying to program the chip and just make adjustment to the software and/or programmer until you can read it properly.
You can do that by reading the pic and checking the last location in the read buffer, it should be something other than FFF.

If you are using a tait programmer, the reason for this could be the power supply you are using or the drivers needed to access the parallel port.

[Albert35]

Oke here some critics on the vanDuren FIX That isn't the perfect cure..
Not on its own and not together with the Matrix Fix PIC, diodes or what ever.
I think "vanDuren" is a smart en inteligent guy but the way he took in trying
to solve the V12 dead syndrome is the way that will end up in a dead end.

There is a simple way to increase the lifespan of youre PStwo laser it is very
simple to add to a PStwo, V9, V10 and V11 even for people who have dificulties
by programming an PIC12c508.

* The current limiter limits the current for the whole chip and not only the coils

This is the exact reason why the current limiter is dangerous to use becourse it
limits the currunt (but more inportant the power supply) to the whole chip. Why
I will try to explane later...

* The current limiter operates quite slowly! So little peak currents can still go up
to 2 Amps for coil regulation, no problem.

We do not need this slow limiter becours the PIC will shut down the PStwo in 200mS
before the LM317 is responding.

The LM317 is a DC current regulator, not
some high frequency type with a good transient response, which is good in this case.
Even when your system would consume a lot of power and the current limiter would
lower voltage below 6 volts, this would not be a problem. The RS2004FS is an analog
device and not a digital one that needs to be properly reinitialised. Power is
distributed over the motors and the coils and it's opamps by the RS2004FS, when a
"brown out" occurs your motors will move a bit slower and the whole issue will
resolve itsself.

There is youre mistake..The RS2004FS is NOT an analog device but is a digital device..
Why simple: The spindle and sled motors are stepping motors they respond to digital pulses.
So they will not turn a litle slower afther power supply drops but they do not get
the right pulses so they can do strange things.

* When I was testing my many different current limiters at the university I found that
this simple one performs "good enough". During a Mechacon crash your coils will at least
hold out those 3 seconds your PIC needs to turn off the console. Even if the PIC would
fail to turn it off you "at least" have some spare time to walk to the PSTwo and pull
out the plug.

Again the pic turns off the PStwo in 200mS and if the PIC fails you are right your limiter
gives us some extra time... But a PIC does not have the reputaition to fail or work
intermittently and we do not need this time becours if the PIC is tested once
and is working the limiter does not have to come in action becours it is to slow.


* I would like to hear a very good explanation too about why lowering the voltage under
6 volts and the "strange behaviour" that would result would EVER damage the console or
the motors ;-). This strange behaviour is what happens on a brown out. When the sled
motor is accellerated for instance to move to a certain position and in the same time
the spindle motor would turn on and the maximum current would not be sufficient to power
both motors, then one or both of the motors would go slower all of a sudden. You can
hear this accellerating and slowing down of the motors and the disc wouldn't read on
normal speeds, those are "strange responses" in my opinion, but would never ever do any
damage, they would just suck.

And again: The spindle and sled motors are stepping motors they respond to digital pulses.
So they will not turn a litle slower afther power supply drops but they do not get
the right pulses so they can do strange things.
1 example there could be 2 pulsus to the motor coils at a time this can result in short
circuit when 1 coils get a puls on both ends of the coil.. At that point RS2004FS will die.
Don't say this is imposible... The PStwo can switch the turn direction of the spindle motor
to stop it from turning (this is called bracking to stop the DVD from turning) you can
notice this sometimes when you open the cover and see the DVD turn anti clockwise.


There is still nobody responding that will help help change the code for the Matrix PIC fix
mabey you can help "vanDuren" we are living not far from each other so it is easy for us to
come up with a good solution to this problem..
We do not have to limit but whe have to sence and simplyfy just as the guys did at Philips
back in the 80's when they strugled with the same problems while they invented the CD player.

[Albert35]

Here some info for those who cant program a PIC12C508

How to make programmer working:
Problems with programming PIC12C508 may be caused by:
a) Too low voltage swing at RS232 output.
b) Too low current at RS232 output.
c) Other software, or hardware problems. (Use P50XV15.ZIP).
d) Too low voltage to program e.g. PIC12C508
In first cases, try folowing:
a) Diode in RS232 ground makes it possible to use the voltage swing more efficient:

2x1N4148 Or one resistor:
|-|>|-| (300 to 400 ohm)
Programmer --| |-- RS232 GND (7) Programmer --[ R ]-- RS232 GND (7)
|-|<|-|

However, laptops with only +/-5V voltage swing will not work properly.
b) Try to add a 2*9V battery with serial connected current limmiting resistor across C2:

+18V ------[E220]------ +C2

0V ------------------ -C2

d) The reson for the too low voltage, may bee that the programmer short RTS to GND by
D4 and PIC too. That means that some computers, that not have surfient power to keep
the signals high, will drop voltage on TxD, and then not have enough voltage to program
PIC12C508. Also the high value into PIC, may lead some current into ground, and thereby
take some power from Vdd, too. The solution here, may bee a resistor in serie with RTS
(maybee 1K).

[Chip&Chop]

Nicely done Albert35 :ups:

Chip&Chop

[Albert35]

Oke before everyone is coming over me.
I have Read the new RIPPER fix.. Here are some comments to it..

Ripper fix is not solving the problem MECHACON or DSP will crash It is not buying you time to unplug the power from youre PStwo when they crash. It is only cleaning the power supply lines to the DSP.

Note this: They are still talking abouth other mod-chips are killing PStwo's but at the same time they tell noise on the power line does kill them.. IT IS FOR SURE THAT OTHER MOD-CHIPS DO NOT CREATE THIS NOISE ON THE POWER LINE'S..
It is also that RIPPER team ripped the code from INFINITY so if what they say INFINITY will kill PStwo's than RIPPER will do also becourse INFINITY code is RIPPER code...
Don't look to mutch at there fancy scope pictures on page 16 of there new document they say it is simulated NOISE in normal words they created the noise becourse is was not there eventualy !! NICE COMERCIAL TRICK i think they start selling PCB's with vanDuren FIX in some days.

I will evaluate there solution in the morning.. I think they are on track of a solution that almost matches mine, but I have to do some measurments to see if that is right.

[Drewus]

Am i the only one who doesn't know WHAT the hell to believe at the moment?

I'm considering ordering a D M S 4 for my PSTwo, but with all these supposed fixes working/not working, i dont know if it's worthwhile.....

[Ruddicz]

I would hold out on the V12's. I would say it will be at least 6 months until the problem is cured, if it even is. Theres a lot of models of PStwos made, and a lot of different countries that have them. Its almost impossible to know if a fix will work on all V12 models until adequate tests have been made. If your ancy about playing backups, theres no harm in getting a *** 4, if you install it yourself you can throw it in an older PS2 until a proper fix is out, then swap the chip out. I know I wouldn't want to be in the middle of GTA:SA and almost done a mission and the darn thing reset on me.

[N£TM£ÇH]

Hold off...... ps2two is a downgrade from the ps2 anyway.. who cares if its thinner.. what people care about if the damn thing works. Im selling version 7 premods so anyone who doesnt want to play russian roulette with the v12 pm me.

[XcalibEr]

There is still nobody responding that will help help change the code for the Matrix PIC fix
mabey you can help "vanDuren" we are living not far from each other so it is easy for us to
come up with a good solution to this problem..
We do not have to limit but whe have to sence and simplyfy just as the guys did at Philips
back in the 80's when they strugled with the same problems while they invented the CD player.

NIce work.
Well it's been a year since the last time i was programming a microchip, but i'll be glad to help.

contact me and tell me what i need to do and i'll start working on it today.

[XcalibEr]

Oke before everyone is coming over me.
I have Read the new RIPPER fix.. Here are some comments to it..

Ripper fix is not solving the problem MECHACON or DSP will crash It is not buying you time to unplug the power from youre PStwo when they crash. It is only cleaning the power supply lines to the DSP.

Note this: They are still talking abouth other mod-chips are killing PStwo's but at the same time they tell noise on the power line does kill them.. IT IS FOR SURE THAT OTHER MOD-CHIPS DO NOT CREATE THIS NOISE ON THE POWER LINE'S..
It is also that RIPPER team ripped the code from INFINITY so if what they say INFINITY will kill PStwo's than RIPPER will do also becourse INFINITY code is RIPPER code...
Don't look to mutch at there fancy scope pictures on page 16 of there new document they say it is simulated NOISE in normal words they created the noise becourse is was not there eventualy !! NICE COMERCIAL TRICK i think they start selling PCB's with vanDuren FIX in some days.

I will evaluate there solution in the morning.. I think they are on track of a solution that almost matches mine, but I have to do some measurments to see if that is right.

U convinced me :D

[Albert35]

XcalibEr wathc youre Private message box..

Oke tested this morning the Ripper solution.

This is my opinion abouth this solution:
It looks nice it cleans some noise (not to mutch) from the supply to the MECHACON.. It olso cleans some other signals a litle but not enough to be safe...
It is using way to many expensive components.. For a to litle result
So I will not going to use it.

And A litle update on the vanDuren FIX
The curent limiter (regulator) he is using is olso pruducing some noise and needs to be decoupled when used with a few capacitors to prevent is from producing noise and in worst case to prevent it from oscilating.
Why simple:
The moment this LM317 comes in action it starts to produce noise on the power lines this isn't to bad... (every regulater does it) But the moment voltage drops on the 2004FS whe are in big trouble this chip will produce signals on its power supply what can couse the LM317 to go crazy and oscilate. The consequense of this can be that full current can go to oure poor coils burning them...

[foundmy]

well, some of the people testing different solutions and including our own variant.

update: our problem with dvd-rw media halting/hanging the bus have been solved.
To report,they have tested GTA: SA on a dvd-rw and it boots no problem, works, ejects, resets, etc, no problem at all. Once we do a little more testing we will offer the info up. but so far so good. We are testing different media and running it hard, tapping reset, opening the trays with original media as well and movie media.

[DickesB]

@Albert

Changed my mind, seems you know what you talking about, sorry for blaming :rolleyes:

I go for hollidays tomorrow and hope after this week there will be a solution from you. Every day I hope to get informed about the ultimate FIX and of course EVERY day a new one appears. :banghead:

:applaud: Nice work, GO ON! :applaud:

[pitrz]

Can someone confirm what is written in the end of the ripper team fix?
That there is a possibility that only consoles with NCP4672G tend to burn out?
This seems to be very interesting because if this was true, it would probably explain a lot of things, including recent nonavailability of pstwos in the market (shouldn't be true anymore) etc ..

[modordie]

TEKNOZ:

The power supply is putting out 18.4-19VDC [which is perfect - couldnt be better].


OK, now when i insert a fresh 12c508 and VERIFY... IT VERIFIES PERFECTLY.
[also does blankcheck PERFECT].

Then, i load the HEX and attempt another verify [without doing anything but opening the HEX into ICProg] and IT FAILS "Verify failed at address 0000h !"

This is so weird to me, i didnt even flash the PIC and when it attempts to verify what looks like the same, blank chip [red lights flash on the programmer too] it fails... i can read the PIC again to get that blank code in the buffer and it verifies fine again...

WHY IS THIS HAPPENING? it seems like there might be something wrong with the code... i have no clue...

ANY HELP IS GREATLY APPRECIATED :)


noocllez

[darkmaster2]

Sorry to cut in on the conversation, All the shops around here are out of slim PS2s, they are almost out of the old ones too. The reason they give is not because of huge demand, but sony has recalled all V12 units due to a manufacturing fault. I heard this in two separtate stores today. They are all supposed to be getting new stock in this day next week!